Sourced Transcript for BSFC #13: Good-bye Stacey, Good-bye
Brooke Suchomel: 0:19
Welcome to the Baby-sitters Fight Club, where the first rule is, you don't talk about Fight Club. Instead, you talk about the Baby-sitters Club series of books by Anne M. Martin. I'm Brooke Suchomel.
Kaykay Brady: 0:30
And I'm Kaykay Brady.
Brooke Suchomel: 0:32
And this week we are traveling back to May 1988, where the Number One songs that month included a song that I think holds up so well to this day, which is "Wishing Well," by Terence Trent D'Arby.
Kaykay Brady: 0:45
"Wishing well, a kiss and tell. Oh wishing well, the buffalo spring?" What?
Brooke Suchomel: 0:55
I don't know. That's where I'm like (gibberish). You know, that's where you just kind of like take the voice down a little bit and you pretend like you know what he's saying there. I could just look it up.
Kaykay Brady: 1:09
But why? Spoils the...
Brooke Suchomel: 1:10
But why?
Kaykay Brady: 1:11
Yeah, that's what I remember. “Wishing well, to kiss and tell, oh wishing well, a butterfly spring? A butterfly wing?” I don't know, something like that.
Brooke Suchomel: 1:23
I don't know. But it's a good tune. Highly recommend.
Kaykay Brady: 1:26
I remember like a porkpie hat. Am I right about that?
Brooke Suchomel: 1:29
I don't know if he had the porkpie hat in this video. He had, like, cool dreads. Terence Trent D'Arby was like, in '88 you're like, "This dude is from the future." He's cooler than everybody, you know?
Kaykay Brady: 1:41
He's from the future!
Brooke Suchomel: 1:43
Yeah.
Kaykay Brady: 1:43
There's a lot of wishing wells in the future. Go figure.
Brooke Suchomel: 1:46
It's a song that, when I hear that song, I'm like, "Oh my god, that was from '88?" It seems like a song that would come later. It seems like a cool early 90s song.
Kaykay Brady: 1:56
Yeah, I mean, the 90s are definitely looming by '88. So you're gonna get artists that are looking forward.
Brooke Suchomel: 2:03
Right, but you have that, and then the next Number One song that immediately followed it was Gloria Estefan's "Anything for You," which is like-
Kaykay Brady: 2:11
Blahhhhhhh.
Brooke Suchomel: 2:13
Right. Like you're getting a dental cleaning.
Kaykay Brady: 2:16
Get out of my head! I was just about to say, you hear that in your orthodontist's office.
Brooke Suchomel: 2:21
Exactly. That's what it is. That song comes on, and you think of laying back with metal in your mouth and people looming over you.
Kaykay Brady: 2:28
You got braces?
Brooke Suchomel: 2:29
No.
Kaykay Brady: 2:29
You never had braces?
Brooke Suchomel: 2:31
No.
Kaykay Brady: 2:32
You have amazing teeth!
Brooke Suchomel: 2:34
I know, it's like the one advantage-
Kaykay Brady: 2:35
And you're like, a lot Irish, right?
Brooke Suchomel: 2:37
Yeah.
Kaykay Brady: 2:39
How? This does not compute!
Brooke Suchomel: 2:41
Maybe I'm not! Maybe I'm finding some family secrets. I have good teeth, so that means I can't be Irish.
Kaykay Brady: 2:50
You do not have Irish teeth, my friend. Wow.
Brooke Suchomel: 2:54
You had braces?
Kaykay Brady: 2:55
Oh, sure. Yeah, I had headgear. I had braces.
Brooke Suchomel: 2:57
Ah.
Kaykay Brady: 2:58
My mom had extremely fucked up teeth. She got them capped later, when we started making some amount of money, but they were very crowded and gappy. And the dentist horrified her by saying, "Oh yeah, her teeth are gonna be really bad. They're even gonna be worse than yours." My mom was like, "Ehh..."
Brooke Suchomel: 3:20
Oh, man!
Kaykay Brady: 3:21
I know, very sensitive. We had to have the full Irish girl workup.
Brooke Suchomel: 3:25
Okay, so yeah, you've got a lot of experience with Gloria Estefan's kind of music.
Kaykay Brady: 3:29
Because of all my dental work? Correct.
Brooke Suchomel: 3:33
Because of all your dental work, you're like, "I know 'Anything for You.'"
Kaykay Brady: 3:37
I probably could even sing it in Spanish. Because, you remember, either there's a verse in Spanish or a Spanish version that also was very popular.
Brooke Suchomel: 3:46
Okay. Yeah, that sounds about right.
Kaykay Brady: 3:47
Maybe that was just in New York City. I don't know.
Brooke Suchomel: 3:49
Probably. Yeah, they weren't playing that as much in the Iowa market, not at that time. No. Not a whole lot of diversity in 1988 Iowa, unfortunately. The big movies that month, it was not a great month for movies, the next episode is going to be rich with movies, but this was the dumping ground, obviously. So we had Crocodile Dundee II, Rambo III, and then Willow.
Kaykay Brady: 4:21
Willow's solid.
Brooke Suchomel: 4:22
Right, but that was the only movie that month that I was like, okay, that seems like something that held up. But that was low on the popularity list at the time. It was all about Crocodile Dundee II.
Kaykay Brady: 4:32
Yeah, it was an HBO classic, though. Willow was on HBO all the time.
Brooke Suchomel: 4:36
Yep.
Kaykay Brady: 4:38
"Willow!"
Brooke Suchomel: 4:40
And then lots of major 80s TV shows aired their final episodes this month. I'm going to talk about four in particular, and I think we're all gonna need to have a moment of silence. Like, collectively, we'll all have a moment of silence for the first three, and then the fourth one, Kaykay, I just want to apologize in advance for potentially bringing up some sad memories.
Kaykay Brady: 5:02
I can't wait. I have so many guesses but I just don't know.
Brooke Suchomel: 5:07
So Jem aired its final episode in May '88. Punky Brewster aired its final episode this month, which they are bringing back. There's gonna be a reboot of Punky Brewster.
Kaykay Brady: 5:20
I think we talked about this super briefly at one point.
Brooke Suchomel: 5:23
I just found out about this one this week. The Wonder Years- so basically, every show we talk about is getting rebooted. But Punky Brewster is getting rebooted, and Punky is a single mom. Punky and Cherie are the original actresses.
Kaykay Brady: 5:40
Soleil Moon Frye?
Brooke Suchomel: 5:41
Yeah.
Kaykay Brady: 5:42
Wow.
Brooke Suchomel: 5:42
So I don't know if all of the original actors are coming back, but at least those two are, and so that's going to be interesting.
Kaykay Brady: 5:50
That's all you need. That and the dog.
Brooke Suchomel: 5:54
I'm pretty sure it's gonna be a recast on the dog.
Kaykay Brady: 5:58
What? Maybe they've just been cloning the dog continuously.
Brooke Suchomel: 6:03
The dog got stuck in the- remember the refrigerator? Where they got stuck in the refrigerator?
Kaykay Brady: 6:09
Of course!
Brooke Suchomel: 6:09
The dog got stuck in a cryogenic chamber and has been frozen in time, and they're gonna thaw the dog out 33 years later. The dog is like Han Solo.
Brooke Suchomel: 6:20
We'll see. Fingers crossed. The Facts of Life aired its final episode in May '88, as well.
Kaykay Brady: 6:26
They really were jumping the shark by then, I can remember.
Brooke Suchomel: 6:29
Yeah, it was a very different Facts of Life from the O.G. Facts of Life, but it aired its final episode this month. And then so did, and I'm sorry to bring this up, Cagney & Lacey.
Kaykay Brady: 6:40
I knew that's what it was gonna be! I was ready for this pain. Well that's all right, it lived on in my heart for like, well into the 90s, because it was syndicated.
Brooke Suchomel: 6:50
Well, and it lived on in TV movies well into the 90s.
Kaykay Brady: 6:54
It did?
Brooke Suchomel: 6:54
So they did four TV movies in the mid 90s.
Kaykay Brady: 6:58
Oh shit.
Brooke Suchomel: 6:58
And I think you might have to track some of these down.
Kaykay Brady: 7:01
Yeah, I never saw these!
Brooke Suchomel: 7:04
They all were called Cagney & Lacey, colon, Something Something Something. And the title that I saw, and I'm like, we have to track this down, and we have to watch it together, and we have to do some sort of live streaming Mystery Science Theater 3000 commentary on it. Because it's called Cagney & Lacey: The View Through the Glass Ceiling.
Kaykay Brady: 7:28
Shut your mouth.
Brooke Suchomel: 7:31
That is an actual movie that aired in the mid 90s on TV.
Kaykay Brady: 7:35
Holy shit. I mean, I'm fighting every urge in my body just to like turn this recording off.
Brooke Suchomel: 7:41
Right, gets up and walks away.
Kaykay Brady: 7:43
You hear the door slam. I'm on a pilgrimage to find this movie.
Brooke Suchomel: 7:49
Goes to like a BitTorrent site to find Cagney & Lacey: The View Through the Glass Ceiling.
Kaykay Brady: 7:53
Correct. I crash my computer and all my financial information is stolen, just for me to get The View Through the Glass Ceiling. Holy shit.
Brooke Suchomel: 8:02
But that would be worth it, right?
Kaykay Brady: 8:04
Yeah, exactly.
Brooke Suchomel: 8:05
It'd be a fair trade.
Kaykay Brady: 8:07
It would be a fair trade.
Brooke Suchomel: 8:08
So that's what was happening in May 1988. And the 13th Baby-sitters Club book, Good-bye Stacey, Good-bye, was released, so it's time for some back cover copy. And I quote, "Oh no! Stacey McGill is moving back to New York! That means no more Stoneybrook Middle School, no more Charlotte Johanssen. And worst of all, no more Baby-sitters Club. Stacey's friends are crushed when they hear that Stacey's moving, Claudia most of all. Stacey was her first best friend. How will the Baby-sitters cope without Stacey? What kind of going-away present is good enough for someone as special as she is? But most important, who is going to be the next member of The Baby-sitters Club?" End quote. So, in the course of just one book we lose our first member of the Baby-sitters Club. What did you think, Kaykay, about how everyone in the book responded to Stacey's repatriation back to New York City?
Kaykay Brady: 9:07
I thought it was a really cool book, because goodbyes are a really important topic for kids.
Brooke Suchomel: 9:15
Mm hmm.
Kaykay Brady: 9:15
And it's not a topic that's often analyzed and discussed and handled well for kids. And especially kids in the 80s, that may have been experiencing a lot of goodbyes, like divorces, changes, moves, right? This is a time in the world where there was more upheaval than there had been in the past. So I thought it was really cool and a thoughtful handling of it and the way that different kids are going to react differently. You know, some kids are going to be kind of in denial, some are just going to be outright crying, some are not really going to be able to believe it or understand it until they see it. Yeah, what did you think?
Brooke Suchomel: 10:01
I thought that the perspective, the fact that this was told from Stacey's perspective, and that it was immediately after the last book, which was from Claudia's perspective. So we know that it's going to be a long time before we get Claudia's direct perspective on this, because she just had her own book, right? So it's going to basically circle through all of the Baby-sitters Club members. She's going to have the furthest distance away from this event before she can give her direct take on things. I actually was most interested in Claudia's reaction, and we get a little bit of it, where they have their emotional heart to heart, and Claudia says, "You're the first best friend I've ever had." It's great that that was brought into the book, but that was the moment when I was like, man, I wish that we could be in Claudia's head. Because I feel like what would actually be in Claudia's head was maybe things that they couldn't actually vocalize in this book at that time.
Kaykay Brady: 11:08
Hmm. Like what?
Brooke Suchomel: 11:09
Well, this is where we bring in the topic that I wasn't quite sure about the best way to address it in this podcast. But now, I think in this book was actually where it's most important to bring it up, is what must feel like an overwhelming outsider status for Claudia in Stoneybrook.
Kaykay Brady: 11:30
Yeah.
Brooke Suchomel: 11:31
You know? It comes up in every book. I would need to go back and do an inventory, but I'm pretty sure Claudia is described as quote unquote "exotic" in every single book. Like, "Who is Claudia?" It's always one of the first things mentioned, right? It's like, Claudia is a bad student, she's an artist, she dresses wild, she has her own phone number, and she's Japanese. It's in the first five things that's mentioned about her. At the time, this wouldn't have read as something concerning, but on page seven, Stacey says, "Claudia is Japanese-American. I'm just American." Today, that's like, "Oooooh..."
Kaykay Brady: 12:12
Not gonna fly.
Brooke Suchomel: 12:13
Yeah, there's a lot to dig into there with like, quote unquote "just American" equaling "blonde."
Kaykay Brady: 12:19
"Real" American.
Brooke Suchomel: 12:21
Yeah, right. Or she's like, "Well, I guess technically I'm Scottish-American and French-American" or something. But it's like, "I'm white, therefore..."
Kaykay Brady: 12:29
"It doesn't count."
Brooke Suchomel: 12:30
"It's not interesting. I don't have a quote unquote 'ethnicity.' Claudia is visibly of a different race. Therefore, she is exotic, therefore, it's one of the first things that we will mention," you know?
Kaykay Brady: 12:42
Yeah, it's so funny, because coming from New York City, you would never just call yourself "white." You know, you would always say, "I'm Irish-American, or Italian-American, or Jewish-American." So it's really funny to see the Connecticut- it's kind of like the California version of white. It's like white without ethnicity, or without understood ethnicity or observed ethnicity.
Brooke Suchomel: 13:07
Right. Would that have been the case with what we see, like, we actually get an address for Stacey at the end, so we know she's living on the Upper West Side, which is kind of what we expected, right?
Kaykay Brady: 13:19
Yeah, isn't that where she came from, the Upper West? Or the Upper East, maybe?
Brooke Suchomel: 13:23
Did they ever specify?
Kaykay Brady: 13:24
I don't know.
Brooke Suchomel: 13:24
I think we assumed. There are a lot of references to Central Park, so we could kind of make that connection. But yeah, I'm the one that literally plugged in that address. I looked up- so that building number does not exist. But Building 15 does exist. So like, the building that would be Stacey's address is a co-op building where everything's going for 5 million and up.
Kaykay Brady: 13:53
Sure.
Brooke Suchomel: 13:53
It's right next to the Museum of Natural History, right on the park.
Kaykay Brady: 13:57
Oh, yeah, and not to jump too far ahead, that was my biggest 80s moment, was that her parents easily found a giant apartment on the Upper West Side in less than a month.
Brooke Suchomel: 14:07
Yeah, like a week or so.
Kaykay Brady: 14:08
I remember when I graduated college and was moving back to New York City, and my dad was living in Connecticut by now, you know, cuz once my parents could get out of New York, they never looked back, never wanted to move back there. But he's like, "You should be able to get a two bedroom apartment for $800 or $900." I was like, "Dad, you're smoking crack." And I showed him the New York Times listings. This was back before the internet. And he looked at it and he told me that it was errors. It was incorrect. That's how sure he was.
Brooke Suchomel: 14:39
Right. Every single listing, they just added an extra digit. Something went wrong in the printing press.
Kaykay Brady: 14:45
Something went wrong with the printer! But that's my dad. That's my dad. That was probably 2002 or something. I mean, it was already crushing, so today, it's absurdly crushing, but the 80s was awesome. A lot of crime, but you could live there for really cheap.
Brooke Suchomel: 15:02
That's what I was wondering, like, in the Upper West Side circles, if "I'm," quote, "just American" would be a mentality that you might actually see.
Kaykay Brady: 15:15
Yeah, exactly. It's socioeconomic. It's pure socioeconomics.
Brooke Suchomel: 15:19
Definitely. But she mentioned, when she sort of breaks down when Stacey says that she's moving away, Claudia says that she never had a best friend before and that she felt quote, "different." She's always felt different, and she gives every reason but race. You know? I would think that now, the book would tackle this.
Kaykay Brady: 15:45
Yes, it would be addressed. I wonder if it's addressed in the Netflix show?
Brooke Suchomel: 15:49
Yeah, from what I've seen in the Netflix show, they don't have Stacey move away, so it would be interesting to see later on. But when Stacey says, "How come you never had a best friend?" Claudia shrugs and says, quote, "I always felt different from the other kids. Older, I guess." And then talks about how she gave up dressing up stuffed animals, she was always taking art classes, trying new things with hair and makeup, and felt "worlds apart" with other kids in her grade. And it's like, there's something pretty obvious there, which is, Stoneybrook is white as fuck.
Kaykay Brady: 16:24
Yeah.
Brooke Suchomel: 16:25
Kaykay Brady: 16:37
It makes me wonder how aware the author is, even, of how this might be an issue. Or is the author just kind of steeped in the time and throwing out the exoticness and the "I'm a real American" just because that's the way the author would think of it, and the author wouldn't be able to go as far to get into Claudia's head. I'm curious, and I'm sort of leaning towards that interpretation.
Brooke Suchomel: 17:01
Yeah.
Kaykay Brady: 17:02
It's like a blind spot.
Brooke Suchomel: 17:03
Yeah, it's definitely unclear. And with you and I having that memory of what things were like back in the late 80s, I mean, these weren't things that were talked about.
Kaykay Brady: 17:15
No.
Brooke Suchomel: 17:16
If quote unquote "race" was an issue, it was like, "Isn't it good that we overcame this problem, and everyone's equal now?"
Kaykay Brady: 17:24
Younger listeners, if you want to just get a flavor of the 80s, go watch 80s commercials. Every commercial's like, "We're white people doing white things! All you see is white faces! We're chewing gum! We're on a jet ski!"
Brooke Suchomel: 17:38
Yeah, that is 80s commercials. Chewing gum, on a jet ski, white.
Kaykay Brady: 17:42
You literally do not see a POC the whole day watching TV.
Brooke Suchomel: 17:48
Right. Or if you do, it'll be like one person, and it's kind of thrown in. And you can tell it's thrown in like, "Look at how diverse we are! Racism is over in America!" Yeah. That's what it was like, and it was bullshit. But it was interesting how in this book, too, the Pikes think that their new neighbors are spies because they have a long last name and accent.
Kaykay Brady: 18:12
I know! And I like how she makes it French. Oh, come on. Yeah right!
Brooke Suchomel: 18:17
Even the French are not welcome in Stoneybrook, right? Even the French!
Kaykay Brady: 18:23
Holy shit. So I did live next door to a spy.
Brooke Suchomel: 18:27
The Ice Cream Man? It all makes sense!
Kaykay Brady: 18:32
No, this was later when we got enough money to move to Westchester. But his name was Robert Hanssen, and he was a huge spy for the Russians, and he was our next door neighbor. We both played with his kids, and when-
Brooke Suchomel: 18:44
W-w-w-w-wait. Wait wait wait. There's been a profile, like, his daughter wrote about this. Oh shit!
Kaykay Brady: 18:50
Yeah, there's movies about him and stuff. Anyway, he was our neighbor.
Brooke Suchomel: 18:54
Wow!
Kaykay Brady: 18:55
But he was just a regular old, cranky white dad. Shock shock. He was not French.
Brooke Suchomel: 19:00
Did he speak in a French accent?
Kaykay Brady: 19:02
No. But yeah, when he got arrested, the New York Times [sic] called me, called my sister.
Brooke Suchomel: 19:07
What?
Kaykay Brady: 19:09
Yeah, isn't that crazy?
Brooke Suchomel: 19:10
Wow! Oh man, this is gonna get real fun now. Okay, so listeners, if you're not checking out our social media or our website, which is just babysitters fight club.com. We post transcripts with and links to all kinds of stuff. So I'm gonna be linking the shit out of this. Hell yeah! Hell yeah. Wow, that's awesome.
Kaykay Brady: 19:35
Yeah, I knew you'd find that fascinating.
Brooke Suchomel: 19:37
So did he give any indication, or was he just, like, bland generic boring dad?
Kaykay Brady: 19:43
Just like, you know, just like us. They were just a Catholic boring family with a bunch of kids. I mean, we didn't have a bunch of kids, but they had a bunch of kids. There was just nothing unique about them whatsoever.
Brooke Suchomel: 19:55
Which makes him a perfect spy.
Kaykay Brady: 19:57
Exactly. When I heard later I was like, "What? Mr. Hanssen?"
Brooke Suchomel: 20:02
That's so crazy!
Kaykay Brady: 20:05
Yeah, so not French. Just regular old American.
Brooke Suchomel: 20:09
But like, Claudia is the one that is babysitting for the Pikes as they are like, "We've got new people, they speak in a way that we're not used to." The accent freaks them out, and remember, Claudia's grandma, as it's brought up over and over again, Mimi speaks with an accent. So that is something that automatically marks you as different. And the Pikes are doing some serious Patriot Act shit, right? Like, laying down on the ground, spying into every room cataloging things.
Kaykay Brady: 20:40
Climbing trees.
Brooke Suchomel: 20:41
Yeah. So Claudia must be having so many things going through her head, and we don't see that.
Kaykay Brady: 20:48
It's such a good point. I'm so curious if that was something contemplated at all by Ann M. Martin.
Brooke Suchomel: 20:55
Right. Okay, so real quick, though, cuz now I'm just like- I'm fixated on the fact that you know a spy. Did you ever spend the night at the spy's house?
Kaykay Brady: 21:06
Probably not. My parents were very anal about who and where we stayed the night at.
Brooke Suchomel: 21:13
They were like, "This guy's giving us spy vibes."
Kaykay Brady: 21:17
God, I wish we could dial my sister in, because when the New York Times reporter called me, I was such a little sister. I didn't remember jack shit. And then of course, they called my sister and my sister was like, "Oh, yeah, they seem strapped for money. They were this, they were that. Blah blah blah." She remembered everything.
Brooke Suchomel: 21:34
Your sister was Jordan Pike, running reconnaissance. "Something's off with this dude. I'm gonna be handing out badges. Anybody that gives me intel, you get a badge."
Kaykay Brady: 21:46
I can't believe I didn't know, because I had a whole spy kit that I got from Service Merchandise for one Christmas. It was like, you know, some shitty camera that didn't work, some shitty microphone that didn't work, and other shitty things that didn't work, but I would have been all about it. Please. But I learned too late.
Brooke Suchomel: 22:04
You're really selling the spy kit. I love it. It's a bunch of shitty things that don't work, and you put "Spy Kit" on the box, and kids will eat that shit up.
Kaykay Brady: 22:13
That's exactly right. Throw some batteries- you gotta put batteries in something. It's exciting!
Brooke Suchomel: 22:18
Definitely. So yeah, I think that the person, as I'm reading this, that I was most concerned about was Claudia. Knowing that she's somebody who clearly felt othered and felt very isolated in this community. And you know, she says that, "We were the same." Like, she saw they were both wearing off the shoulder sweatshirts when she met Stacey, and it was like, "We're kindred spirits." So now she's going to be without that. So, you know, that part I wish we had a little bit more time with. But I did think that with Stacey, the way that the author showed her sort of vacillating back and forth between like, "Okay, am I excited about this? Am I sad about this?" And how it's not like, one emotion. To me, that read as being very authentic.
Kaykay Brady: 23:11
Very. You know, it's very human, in general, just to have ambivalence about change. And, you know, knowing there's good things, knowing there's bad things. Ah, I just think she needs to ditch Laine.
Brooke Suchomel: 23:24
Laine sucks!
Kaykay Brady: 23:25
Laine sucks! Okay. I just want to say, the worst thing you can ever do to a friend is to tell your friend shit someone said behind their back.
Brooke Suchomel: 23:34
Yes.
Kaykay Brady: 23:35
Never ever do that to a friend. Because the only reason you're doing that is to make yourself feel better because you feel bad about this negative thing that you heard. Don't share it with your friend. Just keep it to yourself.
Brooke Suchomel: 23:49
Right.
Kaykay Brady: 23:49
So that happens twice to Stacey in this episode. It was Laine doing it about the kids in her class, that they don't like her, reminding her-
Brooke Suchomel: 23:58
Yeah, there's one girl in particular.
Kaykay Brady: 23:59
Yeah, reminding her when she says, "I'm moving back to New York and I think I'm excited," and then Laine basically reminds her, "Oh, everybody hates you because you have diabetes." Thanks, Laine!
Brooke Suchomel: 24:09
Right. Laine's like, "I'm excited but everybody else hates your guts." It's so manipulative.
Kaykay Brady: 24:12
Exactly! It's so manipulative.
Brooke Suchomel: 24:14
It's so manipulative.
Kaykay Brady: 24:16
And then fucking Claudia does the same thing to her about this boy, whoever- Howie? I don't know what his fucking name is.
Brooke Suchomel: 24:23
Okay, that was some garbage.
Kaykay Brady: 24:24
Right! Like, why are you slanging this to your friend? Keep it to yourself, dude.
Brooke Suchomel: 24:28
Well, not even that, but that was actually the first thing I flagged, like, okay, this is some bullshit right here. Where Stacey says Howie Johnson is going to the library with Dori- like, Dorianne Wallingford has a great name. And I see why she is the off screen character that is brought up over and over again, because her name is Dorianne Wallingford. She sounds like she's in Dynasty. It's fantastic. But like, Howie's going to the library with another girl. And Stacey's like, "He's not my boyfriend. He's not anything like that. We just went to a couple dances together in the past," and she's like furious that he's going to a library with another girl. And Claudia and Stacey just talk about it amongst themselves and just start talking mad shit and deciding that they both suck. And then they freeze them out. Like, that is authentic, at least to my experience, but it is so unhealthy.
Kaykay Brady: 25:26
It tracks. I mean, it tracks for the age.
Brooke Suchomel: 25:28
It tracks 100%. And '90s. And probably still to this day for a lot of people.
Kaykay Brady: 25:33
Yeah, I mean, some grown ups never find any other way.
Brooke Suchomel: 25:37
Right. It's like, "Oh, I feel uncomfortable or upset about something. I don't feel confident enough to raise it and talk it out with the person that I'm having a conflict with. I'm not even going to tell them that I have a conflict with them. Instead I'm just gonna stew about it, and I'm gonna let it corrode me from the inside and make me a bitter person."
Kaykay Brady: 25:58
It's a hard way to live.
Brooke Suchomel: 25:59
Yeah. Not great.
Kaykay Brady: 26:00
It's a really hard way to live.
Brooke Suchomel: 26:01
So hopefully that is just a moment in time that that is their reaction. Hopefully, adult Stacey and Claudia are coping with things differently. But it's true, it does feel very authentic to the time.
Kaykay Brady: 26:14
Definitely.
Brooke Suchomel: 26:15
But the way that this just gets sprung on Stacey by her parents.
Kaykay Brady: 26:20
Massively sprung on her. "We're doing it in a month!"
Brooke Suchomel: 26:23
Right. Like, "Oh, I already put the house on the market," you know? Just blindsides her. She doesn't know how to feel, and then her parents just immediately jump in with the bribes. And then she's like, "Okay, this is great." And to me, you know, just jumping ahead to like, what are they fighting? That is the metaphor. So I felt like what they're fighting is a lack of agency over their lives. When you're a child, you don't get to really make many decisions for yourself. You are along for the ride at all times. So much of your life is not your own. And when you're this age, when you're 13, you're really wanting to start to assert your independence, there are a lot of times where you just can't. You just have to go along with what the adults in your life are doing.
Kaykay Brady: 27:12
Most times! And the hard thing for these kids is they have no agency, but they have basically all of the responsibility.
Brooke Suchomel: 27:18
Right, exactly.
Kaykay Brady: 27:20
They're not so much like kids you might see today in that socioeconomic spectrum, where they have no agency, but also, not that much is expected of them in terms of keeping their families, their parents, the kids that they babysit for on healthy emotional ground all the time.
Brooke Suchomel: 27:40
Right. Yeah, they have no agency, but it's not like, you know, at least while you don't have the ability to make your own choices, somebody else is really looking out for you and caring for you.
Kaykay Brady: 27:49
Correct.
Brooke Suchomel: 27:50
You still have to look out for yourself and care for yourself, and-or potentially the adults who should be caring for you.
Kaykay Brady: 27:58
Well that's right, because we see how a lot of these adults crash and burn when they move. You know, Dawn's mother, she crash and burns, sort of. I mean, Dawn has to care for her a lot.
Brooke Suchomel: 28:11
That was the other person that I thought was really reflective of, like, Stacey doesn't have this agency, she has to just go along with the ride. And Jeff, Dawn's brother, doesn't have it either. He wants to go back to be with their dad, and I would say that living in a house where you can't walk through the living room because there's trash everywhere, you can't even sit on the couch without sitting on a can of creamed spinach. You know, that might have something to do with it. Maybe going back and spending the summer with their dad where perhaps he wasn't sitting on spinach-
Kaykay Brady: 28:44
So, just for listeners, there was a random can of creamed spinach and papers everywhere on the couch for no reason.
Brooke Suchomel: 28:51
For no reason. So Mary Anne is babysitting for Dawn's brother Jeff, while Dawn and Dawn's mom go to an event at the library where they talk about the various haunted houses of Stoneybrook. And Mary Anne describes, Jeff just goes into his room and slams the door, probably because his room is clean, I would assume. I would not want to be in this living room either. The floor is covered in crumpled up paper, screwdrivers in the corner, old rugs and stuff on the floor, a can of creamed spinach just sitting on the couch for no reason whatsoever. So this is not a very stable and comfortable environment.
Kaykay Brady: 29:37
No.
Brooke Suchomel: 29:37
But he's 10 years old. So he's just along for the ride for what his parents decide to do with him. He doesn't get to assert himself in any way. So I thought he was a good mirror for Stacey in that way. But that is the battle that it seems like everybody has, you know, your point about they still have all of the responsibility. I mean, Stacey is like, "Okay, well, Mom doesn't know what to do with all of the shit in the house that we have to figure out what to do with it. Okay, my friends and I will run this yard sale."
Kaykay Brady: 30:11
Capitalism saves them again!
Brooke Suchomel: 30:13
Capitalism is the tool that they're using to fight their lack of agency. And just because it's a tool that they're using doesn't mean it's a good tool to use.
Kaykay Brady: 30:23
Yeah, and not only are they using it to fight the lack of agency, they're really using it to process and work out the changes and the loss.
Brooke Suchomel: 30:34
Right.
Kaykay Brady: 30:35
They're really sort of holding on to it as this almost cathartic event that they're going to do together to kind of make this change positive, right? They literally make money off the change, and then they turn the money into a party for their friend.
Brooke Suchomel: 30:52
Exactly. So your take is a very positive spin on it, which I like-
Kaykay Brady: 30:57
I think that's how it's, you know, on the face- without any kind of 2021 interpretation, this is the presentation of it.
Brooke Suchomel: 31:06
It's their coping mechanism. And on the surface, I agree, it's like, "Okay, we're gonna solve this problem. We're gonna throw a party, it's going to bring us closer together." But deep down, what is it really? It's a distraction.
Kaykay Brady: 31:21
Exact. Exact.
Brooke Suchomel: 31:22
It's 100% a distraction. So this book becomes not so much like, "Wow, our friend is leaving. Let's spend time, let's talk through things. Let's make the most of this." Instead, it's like, "No, let's focus so much attention on running a yard sale, and also keeping her out, because we're going to get together and plan things."
Kaykay Brady: 31:43
And she can't be a part of it.
Brooke Suchomel: 31:45
Right. She can't be a part of it, and so it's distancing. It's putting an additional wall up. Subconsciously, not intentionally, but like, ultimately that is-
Kaykay Brady: 31:54
Definitely.
Brooke Suchomel: 31:55
It's like, "We're going to focus on the party. We're going to focus on the yard sale, we're going to focus on these distractions that will give us an out for having to focus on how we're actually feeling."
Kaykay Brady: 32:06
Well, you're blowing my mind, because it's making me realize this entire series is just a distraction from the core problem, which is poor David Michael and the divorce. The entire series is just a distraction from this divorce.
Brooke Suchomel: 32:22
From David Michael's suffering.
Kaykay Brady: 32:24
Yes.
Brooke Suchomel: 32:25
Right, The Baby-sitters Club, an alternate title, "Or David Michael's Suffering."
Kaykay Brady: 32:29
"David Michael Goes to Therapy," Book One, End of Series.
Brooke Suchomel: 32:35
Right. If everybody wasn't distracting themselves with the real problems in their lives, we wouldn't have a book series to read, or to talk about, or to analyze. Is this podcast a distraction for us? We're just gonna go real meta.
Kaykay Brady: 32:49
Oh, this is like an Inception level mindfuck that we're in right now.
Brooke Suchomel: 32:54
We're not even here. You think that you're hearing us. You're not hearing us. You're just distracting yourself from your real problems. We just lose every listener. Sorry, stay with us.
Kaykay Brady: 33:05
You're here. You're real. Feel your body. Feel your feet on the floor.
Brooke Suchomel: 33:09
We're just fucking with you and ourselves. I have to say, so as we're talking about Inception, it takes me back to where there was an Inception moment in this book. Did you pick it up? Was there a moment in this book where you were just like, "What the fuck is going on? Is everyone on molly?"
Kaykay Brady: 33:23
No, tell me.
Brooke Suchomel: 33:24
There's a page in this book where I feel like everyone's on molly because it makes no sense. So it is where Stacey goes over, I think it's to Mary Anne's house, and she walks into the room where they're all getting together to plan Stacey's party in secret. She walks in and people are wearing visors and blowing big pink bubbles. And Dawn's just doing a handstand in the corner.
Kaykay Brady: 33:49
Oh right! Yes.
Brooke Suchomel: 33:50
And it's not explained. No explanation whatsoever.
Kaykay Brady: 33:53
Multiple visors, not just Kristy. The visors are spreading.
Brooke Suchomel: 33:55
Right, multiple visors. When it said "blowing pink bubbles," it took me a minute, I was like, oh, they're blowing bubbles, like bubble gum. I read it at first and thought they were blowing soap bubbles with a wand-
Kaykay Brady: 34:08
Oh, that would be dope.
Brooke Suchomel: 34:09
As Dawn does a handstand in the corner, and I'm like, what is happening here?
Kaykay Brady: 34:13
It's Burning Man, basically. They're watching the Burning Man.
Brooke Suchomel: 34:16
This is the genesis of Burning Man, actually. It started in Mary Anne's room. This is what happens when she gets oppressed for so long.
Kaykay Brady: 34:24
Kristy doesn't really attend, she just makes money.
Brooke Suchomel: 34:25
Oh, Kristy just plans it.
Kaykay Brady: 34:26
Kristy just makes all the money, but she doesn't want to go. That's nonsense.
Brooke Suchomel: 34:29
She's not going to that shit show. Hell no.
Kaykay Brady: 34:31
No way. Dawn is-
Brooke Suchomel: 34:32
Be all dirty and hot, and people fucked up. Yeah, Dawn will be running the place, in person.
Kaykay Brady: 34:37
Dawn will be running the place.
Brooke Suchomel: 34:38
Right, but Kristy's back counting the checks.
Kaykay Brady: 34:41
And then Stacey is definitely on as many drugs as she can find. And I don't know what Claudia is doing.
Brooke Suchomel: 34:46
Karen is just freaking everyone the fuck out. Karen is sneaking up to the people that are on molly and just whispering in their ear about like-
Kaykay Brady: 34:56
"You're gonna die someday."
Brooke Suchomel: 34:59
Right, exactly!
Kaykay Brady: 35:01
That's my Karen.
Brooke Suchomel: 35:03
That's Karen! "You're gonna die someday." - Karen Brewer
Kaykay Brady: 35:08
"I know you're on molly in the middle of the desert feeling like you're invincible and you're so young and happy. But you're gonna die some day."
Brooke Suchomel: 35:17
Yeah, yeah, maybe that's what's in Claudia's heavenly brownies that she brings.
Kaykay Brady: 35:22
Oh shit!
Brooke Suchomel: 35:23
Because Claudia's got the "heavenly brownies."
Kaykay Brady: 35:24
There is more Morbidda Destiny in this book, so the ganj could be what was in that lemonade. Who knows?
Brooke Suchomel: 35:31
Right, she's like, "Heh heh heh. Heh heh heh!" She feeds it to them on the porch.
Kaykay Brady: 35:37
All right, so they get offered lemonade by Morbidda Destiny and they accept it. They go over there and then Morbidda is sort of laughing maniacally. I think, in the end, because it's from concentrate?
Brooke Suchomel: 35:40
Perhaps.
Kaykay Brady: 35:41
And not fresh? I just couldn't figure out why she was laughing maniacally. I don't know. I couldn't figure that one out.
Brooke Suchomel: 35:56
That was strange. It was ominous.
Kaykay Brady: 35:58
It was ominous.
Brooke Suchomel: 35:59
Yeah, but Karen was doing her thing.
Kaykay Brady: 36:02
Yeah, doing The Karen.
Brooke Suchomel: 36:03
It didn't seem- I didn't believe that Karen would go drink that lemonade.
Kaykay Brady: 36:07
I didn't either. It was a bridge too far.
Brooke Suchomel: 36:08
Karen would not drink that lemonade. She would be like, "This lemonade has 5G in it."
Kaykay Brady: 36:12
"This is where the Coronavirus came from."
Brooke Suchomel: 36:17
Right, "Bill Gates controls my mind now, if I drink this lemonade." How Kristy lets Karen quote "fascinate" the kids with conspiracy theories, because it keeps them from fighting with each other. There's no symbolism there. There's no symbolism at all. You can't draw a direct line to that and to the hellscape that we're living in today. No, no. No, not at all. Yeah, so there is a lot going on in this particular book.
Kaykay Brady: 36:40
A lot. A lot.
Brooke Suchomel: 36:42
So there was a lot going on, but not as much discussed, which is kind of the theme of the Baby-sitters Club books. Subtext thick as hell, whereas the text is pretty straightforward. But you can get a lot out of what is focused on and what is not focused on.
Kaykay Brady: 36:58
No doubt about it.
Brooke Suchomel: 37:00
As in any book, but I just think that it's pretty rich in this series.
Kaykay Brady: 37:03
Yeah, this is a very good example of that concept, I think.
Brooke Suchomel: 37:05
Yep. As we talk about, like, the subtext is thick, the text can sometimes be fairly thin, what did you see as the A plot, B plot, C plot for you?
Kaykay Brady: 37:15
I saw the A plot as Stacey moving back to New York, the B plot as the yard sale, and the C plot slash themes, you know, the processing of goodbyes and the party. How about you?
Brooke Suchomel: 37:31
Yeah, I mean, I had all of that. Particularly with the processing of the goodbyes, I thought the bed sheet that they present at the end, it says it's a bed sheet that they unfurl that has "See you soon, Stacey" painted in dripping blue letters. To me that reads like more of a threat than a promise.
Kaykay Brady: 37:52
Karen made that.
Brooke Suchomel: 37:53
Right, that's 100% Karen.
Kaykay Brady: 37:55
They outsourced that to Karen. Yeah, I mean, I didn't understand the bed sheet. So basically, what they did is, right before Stacey leaves for New York, the friends all get out of a car and they have put a message on a bed sheet and they sort of hold it up like "Yay!" But why would they use a bed sheet? They seem crafty enough that they would have some poster board.
Brooke Suchomel: 38:18
Yeah, Claudia would not let a freaking serial killer bedsheet be the thing that she presents to her best friend.
Kaykay Brady: 38:26
She's an artist, for God's sake!
Brooke Suchomel: 38:29
Look at the cover. Look at the way that the letters are dripping.
Kaykay Brady: 38:33
Yeah.
Brooke Suchomel: 38:34
It looks so freaking terrifying. If somebody had that hanging up, I would be like, "Holy shit!" I'd have nightmares about it for the rest of my life.
Kaykay Brady: 38:42
I mean, it looks like what some shitty frat guys might do on the front of their frat house.
Brooke Suchomel: 38:48
Right. But then I also had the last line, not only the last line, so it's the last two lines of the back cover copy. The first part is all about "Stacey's moving," blah, blah, blah, "but most important, who is going to be the next member of the Baby-sitters Club?"
Kaykay Brady: 39:04
"Our pain does not exist. What are you talking about? I don't even miss this person. I've got business to do!"
Brooke Suchomel: 39:10
Right! Well, I mean, Kristy kind of goes there right away. Stacey's, like, "We're moving. And she's like, "Oh, you're moving? Well who's gonna take your place?" It's very focused on jobs, right? "We have a business that we're running-"
Kaykay Brady: 39:22
"As long as we have the revenue coming in, we won't ever need to feel our feelings." Yeah, there was a great quote where it was basically like Kristy says, "I just love selling things and making money. It's gonna be a great day!" That's like a direct quote during the yard sale. I'm like, "Hmm, really, girl? Really?"
Brooke Suchomel: 39:42
Very Kristy. So that was the other plot too, which is emphasized so strongly on the back cover to the point where it's like, "But this is the most important thing of all." And then it's just kind of brought up periodically throughout. It's not a huge focus, but ultimately it's like, "We're gonna have Mallory Pike join the Baby-sitters Club."
Kaykay Brady: 40:04
Mallory Pike is what, 10? 11?
Brooke Suchomel: 40:06
11, I think.
Kaykay Brady: 40:06
She's a little bit younger than the other kids, but she's a good sitter. She's been shadowing them and doing events with them for a while. And they're thinking, "Oh, this is the babysitter that we can advance."
Brooke Suchomel: 40:19
Yes. And they do some pretty obvious foreshadowing, too, when it said, "Well, maybe if we can get two junior sitters, they can both take all of this." So you're like, okay, there's gonna be a second junior sitter that gets enlisted pretty quickly.
Kaykay Brady: 40:32
Is this how the spin off books happen? Isn't there a Little Sister series or something?
Brooke Suchomel: 40:37
So there is Little Sister, which is going to be coming fairly soon, but that is focused on Karen Brewer. And so it's written at a lower reading level. It's definitely aimed at littler kids. The books are smaller, even the print is bigger, you know, but Karen and Boo Boo and Morbidda Destiny and the Papadakises, like, all of those sort of tertiary characters in that neighborhood-
Kaykay Brady: 41:03
I love how, for the younger kids, they're going to star the darkest character with the darkest thoughts.
Brooke Suchomel: 41:10
Yes, exactly.
Kaykay Brady: 41:11
Sure! Why not? Let's go into some existential angst.
Brooke Suchomel: 41:13
It's like the Scary Stories to Tell In the Dark crossover there. And yeah, the very first one is Karen's Witch. So it starts off by focusing on that. So Mallory, the next book is actually a Mallory-centered book. Just like how as soon as Dawn gets introduced, it's kind of like, "Boom! Here's the first Dawn book," we're gonna see the same thing start to happen.
Kaykay Brady: 41:38
I mean, this is all these kids need, is more responsibility by having younger sitters under their moniker.
Brooke Suchomel: 41:43
Right, that they have to mentor.
Kaykay Brady: 41:45
Correct. That's exactly what I would say they need. Can't they get some older sitters? Can't they get, you know, 14? 15?
Brooke Suchomel: 41:53
Well, maybe it's because they got burned when they tried that with the Baby-sitters Agency.
Kaykay Brady: 41:57
Those tramps. Those tramps from the Baby-sitters Agency.
Brooke Suchomel: 42:01
What were their names, like Linda and Janet or something? Mildred and Ethel?
Kaykay Brady: 42:07
No, we just thought one of them should have been Bad Janet.
Brooke Suchomel: 42:10
So yeah, perhaps maybe that's how they want to maintain their control, like, "Must uphold hierarchy at all times. No one older than Kristy. Not allowed."
Kaykay Brady: 42:20
I think that's a valid interpretation. Well, we do know, Kristy is, you know, they make no bones about the fact that she's a bit of a control freak.
Brooke Suchomel: 42:28
Oh, yeah.
Kaykay Brady: 42:28
So having older kids would be hard for Kristy.
Brooke Suchomel: 42:31
Right. Having to potentially feel like somebody with more experience is in your group-
Kaykay Brady: 42:36
Yeah, more knowledge, better judgment. That would be really rough for her. I mean, what would her place be there?
Brooke Suchomel: 42:41
Right. Even her brothers that she's around, like, it's pretty clear- we talked about this a couple of books ago when it was like, "Well yeah, my brothers were technically in charge, but..."
Kaykay Brady: 42:51
"Not really."
Brooke Suchomel: 42:51
She's basically like, "My brothers are not nearly as responsible as I am, so I have to oversee everything."
Kaykay Brady: 42:56
Yeah.
Brooke Suchomel: 42:57
And that's the way it is for most of these kids.
Kaykay Brady: 42:59
Exactly.
Brooke Suchomel: 42:59
Perhaps with the exception of Claudia. What did you have for your Most 80s Moment? Besides, you could actually get an apartment in New York within a month?
Kaykay Brady: 43:09
Well, that was a big one. But another one was the way that when they're babysitting for Marnie, the mom's like, "Just plop her in a playpen!" I thought that was great.
Brooke Suchomel: 43:19
Ugh, fucking Mrs. Barrett again.
Kaykay Brady: 43:21
Mrs. Fucking Barrett is so 80s.
Brooke Suchomel: 43:22
She's the worst. Where she's like, "Yeah, kids, you can have your fucking yard sale when it's Dawn's problem."
Kaykay Brady: 43:31
Yeah, exactly. Exactly. And then she just says, "Plop Marnie in a playpen." That seemed super 80s.
Brooke Suchomel: 43:37
Yeah, I mean, it seems pretty clear that Mrs. Barrett definitely hasn't changed all of her spots, right? Where it's like, Dawn is trying to figure out what the fuck is going on, and Mrs. Barrett's just like, "Yeah, I'm leaving. Bye. I don't care about these kids. These kids are your problem now. Can you not see that I don't give a fuck?" You know? She makes that pretty clear. And then Dawn goes and picks up the little girl and she's wet and hasn't been changed. Dawn's going from living amongst just an absolute train wreck of a home environment-
Kaykay Brady: 44:11
To going into a train wreck of a home.
Brooke Suchomel: 44:13
With like, canned food on furniture, to now take care of this woman's train wreck of a life, too. Poor Dawn.
Kaykay Brady: 44:20
My other 80s Moment was change. I don't mean this as a metaphor, but this book is about change.
Brooke Suchomel: 44:29
Coins!
Kaykay Brady: 44:30
Coins.
Brooke Suchomel: 44:31
Change in every sense of the word.
Kaykay Brady: 44:32
That's right.
Brooke Suchomel: 44:33
In every definition that you might find.
Kaykay Brady: 44:35
But they're like, "Change?" They're not dealing with change. They're gonna deal with coins. Change.
Brooke Suchomel: 44:39
Right.
Kaykay Brady: 44:40
But anyway, the way that they are starting their yard sale and they need to make sure they have enough change. You know, today, you would just be sort of Venmo-ing or whatever. Maybe, I don't know what you'd do. But so anyway, I just thought the change was a very 80s thing.
Brooke Suchomel: 44:55
Yeah, and that Stacey's dad has $10 in change on him.
Kaykay Brady: 45:00
Exactly!
Brooke Suchomel: 45:00
Which- okay, so here's my theory. My theory is that Stacey's dad is in the mob. Hear me out.
Kaykay Brady: 45:07
Please, go. I want this theory. You know my Morbidda Destiny theory, and you were very patient with that one, so I'm all here for you.
Brooke Suchomel: 45:17
The way that they just sort of pick up and leave so quickly, right? And it's like, "Okay, yeah, we can get-" I mean, even in the 80s, so we talked about how, yes, it probably was easier to get an apartment. But like, could you really get, like, a phat apartment? Stacey's mom doesn't work. What do they do? They seem to have a ton of connections with people. It's always who's the latest and the greatest hot diabetes doctor for Stacey to go to. Stacey's dad's a little bit of an asshole, too.
Kaykay Brady: 45:52
He is.
Brooke Suchomel: 45:52
I don't know. It just seemed to me like there's something up. It's kind of like the same thing with the theory that Kevin McAllister's dad in Home Alone is in the mob.
Kaykay Brady: 46:03
I have not heard that theory.
Brooke Suchomel: 46:05
And that's how they have this big house and all that. I don't know. I'm just like, is Stacey's dad in the mob?
Kaykay Brady: 46:10
It's valid.
Brooke Suchomel: 46:11
He's got all this cash on him, no problem. I don't know.
Kaykay Brady: 46:14
Yeah, and also, you know, those big companies that they describe he works for, they don't move like that. You don't move in weeks.
Brooke Suchomel: 46:25
Right. Or if they closed the office, they would put him up in corporate housing while they get stuff situated, so, I dunno.
Kaykay Brady: 46:31
It is very fishy. I like your theory.
Brooke Suchomel: 46:33
That's just- that was a little theory. I got real excited that Stacey got real excited about Benetton.
Kaykay Brady: 46:39
Benetton. What a thing that was.
Brooke Suchomel: 46:41
Yeah. When the bribes came out, you know, when her parents were trying to get her to be okay with the move, and they're basically like, "What stores do you want to go back to?" And Stacey just starts rattling off a bunch of stores and one of the first ones-
Kaykay Brady: 46:54
Including Bloomingdale's. Snooze!
Brooke Suchomel: 46:56
Well, and Ann Taylor. Like, tell me that a 13 year old girl in the 80s was stoked to go to Ann Taylor.
Kaykay Brady: 47:04
No. Ann Taylor was what you went shopping for when you had your first interview after college.
Brooke Suchomel: 47:08
Right. Ann Taylor is where Stacey's mom would shop.
Kaykay Brady: 47:11
Right.
Brooke Suchomel: 47:12
Not Stacey.
Kaykay Brady: 47:13
Yeah, it didn't make any sense. There's no fabulous oversized sweatshirts at Ann Taylor.
Brooke Suchomel: 47:19
No.
Kaykay Brady: 47:20
There is ill-fitting pinching blazers. That's what you get there. You know what's so funny? My partner worked at Ann Taylor after college. I know. And I'm telling Brooke because Brooke knows my partner and my partner-
Brooke Suchomel: 47:36
So did she have to wear Ann Taylor to work?
Kaykay Brady: 47:38
Yes, she did.
Brooke Suchomel: 47:40
Are there pictures?
Kaykay Brady: 47:41
I haven't seen any, but I really need to put my foot down and get some.
Brooke Suchomel: 47:43
Yeah you do!
Kaykay Brady: 47:46
But my partner is this sort of, like, bohemian freewheeling musician. She's just not an Ann Taylor type.
Brooke Suchomel: 47:55
No. Think of an Ann Taylor type. Now think of the opposite. Yep. Mm hmm.
Kaykay Brady: 48:01
And that's my partner.
Brooke Suchomel: 48:04
That is so delightful.
Kaykay Brady: 48:05
I knew you would love that little nugget.
Brooke Suchomel: 48:07
Oh my god, I love that so much. Oh, that's so good. So yeah, for me it was Benetton, it was Dawn wearing a single earring, which were dangling sunglasses, as, quote "the new style." You know, wearing one earring was definitely a thing.
Kaykay Brady: 48:22
Was it? I didn't remember that. But I knew I could ask you and you would remember.
Brooke Suchomel: 48:28
Yeah. I mean, obviously more so for boys.
Kaykay Brady: 48:30
Ah, right.
Brooke Suchomel: 48:30
But then I had three holes in one ear and two holes in the other ear, and sometimes it would just be asymmetrical, that was a thing. It seems like Dawn is kind of feeling her inner Claudia/Stacey, a little bit. Like she's trying to push herself a little bit, and so doing something like that rang true. And then the games. The way that children entertained themselves or they entertain children.
Kaykay Brady: 48:59
Oh, egg races, for example?
Brooke Suchomel: 49:00
Egg on spoon races?
Kaykay Brady: 49:01
Yeah, egg on spoon races.
Brooke Suchomel: 49:03
Yeah. I'm trying to imagine now, like, in a world of screens, omnipresent screens, I'm just trying to imagine getting kids to do egg and spoon races for three hours or whatever, and I don't see it happening.
Kaykay Brady: 49:18
Just tell them that there's a Pokemon at the end of the spoon. I feel like there's a way you could make that happen.
Brooke Suchomel: 49:24
Yeah, "This is a lo fi version of Pokemon GO," or something like that? I don't know. It seemed very Double Dare.
Kaykay Brady: 49:31
Yeah, it is very Double Dare. Well I wondered when they were telling everybody to show up in the party in crappy clothes. I was wondering if we were gonna have a Double Dare situation.
Brooke Suchomel: 49:42
Unfortunately, not this time.
Kaykay Brady: 49:44
We did not. No, we just had shitty egg races.
Brooke Suchomel: 49:46
They had Transformers though.
Kaykay Brady: 49:48
I saw the Transformers! I noted that.
Brooke Suchomel: 49:50
I figured you would get excited about that.
Kaykay Brady: 49:52
Yeah, I was gonna ask you, Brooke, what would have been your ideal going away party?
Brooke Suchomel: 49:59
Oh, man. It's a good question. I would have definitely wanted to do a slumber party. I was into the slumber parties. Everybody staying up late, watching movies, hopefully watching something funny.
Kaykay Brady: 50:13
Lots of junk food.
Brooke Suchomel: 50:13
Yeah, junk food, pizza, and definite prank calling. Like, we would have been prank calling all night long. And it would have been great.
Kaykay Brady: 50:21
If we had been friends when we were young, it would have been bad. Or great. I don't know, we could have been making a living out of-
Brooke Suchomel: 50:31
We would have been bad. In the best way.
Kaykay Brady: 50:34
In the best possible way.
Brooke Suchomel: 50:35
In the best way. What about you? What would have been your ideal going away party?
Kaykay Brady: 50:40
It's such an easy answer. Paintball.
Brooke Suchomel: 50:42
Oh, wow.
Kaykay Brady: 50:43
Paintball stadium. Go play paintball with your friends.
Brooke Suchomel: 50:46
Is that something that you did?
Kaykay Brady: 50:48
Sure, yeah. You know, I really ran with a bunch of boys in my neighborhood with the spy living across the street. We all had paintball guns, and that's what, you know, once I got my sweet BMX bike from my lawn care business, my next goal was the most top of the line paintball gun I could possibly purchase and that was lovely.
Brooke Suchomel: 51:10
Would it just be like guerilla warfare in your neighborhood with paintball?
Kaykay Brady: 51:13
Yes. I mean, we were like feral dogs. We were just all running around the neighborhood being crazy. I mean, you would be walking and all sudden, you'd be like, "Ahh! Ahh!" Somebody would be shooting you with a paintball gun from their window.
Brooke Suchomel: 51:27
So, okay, this wasn't something that you had opted into partake in. You were just going about your life, and then, boom!
Kaykay Brady: 51:33
Well, first of all, I had opted in. But even if you didn't opt in, it would happen. I mean, there was no question. And it sucks. Have you ever actually been hit by a paintball?
Brooke Suchomel: 51:44
I've never, no.
Kaykay Brady: 51:45
Oh, it's terrible. It bruises you. It really hurts. You know when you see it in the movies and people are like, "Ha ha ha," you know? Uh uh. It hurts like a bitch. And every paintball bruises you. You can lose an eye, you know, you can get really hurt. You definitely have to wear goggles. Anyway, so yes, we were just feral war children, Mad Max style, constantly shooting each other with paintball guns, and sometimes BB guns. And I would have loved to go to a paintball arena, which never happened, of course, because parents did not live to please you in the 80s. They just didn't, you know what I mean? Nobody's sort of figuring out what your deepest desire for a party is and making it happen. No, no. But I would have loved a paintball party.
Brooke Suchomel: 52:34
I love that you're like, "It fucking hurts. I would have loved that. That would've been the best."
Kaykay Brady: 52:41
I mean, that's just part of it, you know? I don't know, when you're young, you don't really pay attention to pain like that. Or I didn't. A certain type of youngster, and I was definitely that type of youngster. I didn't really feel pain.
Brooke Suchomel: 52:53
Right. You're like, "This is something to be proud of. See these bruises? Yeah. I earned these."
Kaykay Brady: 52:59
Oh, definitely! You know, it's the kind of thing where you're falling 20 times a day, and it's just what happens. It's just part of life, and it's fun.
Brooke Suchomel: 53:09
Builds character.
Kaykay Brady: 53:11
Yeah, definitely builds character. You know, now, as a middle aged woman, I'm not so much a fan of the pain. Isn't that funny?
Brooke Suchomel: 53:20
Funny how that happens. One might say those two things are related.
Kaykay Brady: 53:24
One might say I'm slightly wiser. I don't know.
Brooke Suchomel: 53:27
So we talked about how, on the back cover copy, you may have been left with the impression that "Who is going to be the next member of the Baby-sitters Club?" was a bigger part of this book than it actually was in the telling. But we did get the answer in this book, and the answer is Mallory Pike is the newest member of the Baby-sitters Club.
Kaykay Brady: 53:45
Welcome aboard!
Brooke Suchomel: 53:46
And so in our next episode, we will be discussing the very first Mallory-centered book, which is Hello, Mallory. So we go from Good-bye Stacey, Good-bye to Hello, Mallory, which- I was never into Seinfeld, but I am familiar with the "Hello, Newman" line delivery. And I have to admit, every time I see Hello, Mallory, I think of it as-
Kaykay Brady: 54:10
"Hello, Mallory." Oh, I'm so delighted that you told me that and now I get to read the book.
Brooke Suchomel: 54:19
We get to see how Mallory acclimates as the first junior member of the Baby-sitters Club in the next episode.
Kaykay Brady: 54:27
What could go wrong?
Brooke Suchomel: 54:28
Everything! We'll find out. So until then...
Kaykay Brady: 54:33
Just keep sittin'. [THEME SONG] We're white people doing white things. All you see is white faces. We're chewing gum. We're on a jet ski!
