Sourced Transcript for BSFC #6: Kristy’s Big Day
Brooke Suchomel: 0:18
Welcome to The Baby-sitters Fight Club, where the first rule is you don't talk about Fight Club. Instead, you talk about the Baby-sitters Club series of books by Anne M. Martin. I'm Brooke Suchomel.
Kaykay Brady: 0:30
And I'm Kaykay Brady.
Brooke Suchomel: 0:31
And this week, we are taking you back to July 1987, when the television phenomenon of the summer was the congressional hearings on the Iran-Contra affair [air horn]. Woo!
Kaykay Brady: 0:48
Do it again. Do it again!
Brooke Suchomel: 0:50
Do it again? [air horn]
Kaykay Brady: 0:58
Iran-Contra!
Brooke Suchomel: 0:58
"What you've all been waiting for," yeah. Tens of millions of people tuned in to watch six days of Oliver North's testimony. And this was such a big event that if you go to IMDB, the Iran-Contra affair has its own IMDB listing as a TV miniseries.
Kaykay Brady: 1:16
Get outta here! That says such sad things about where we have come.
Brooke Suchomel: 1:21
God. And there was just so much wall-to-wall coverage of this that, I found articles from the time, there was actual concern that these hearings might kill off the soap opera.
Kaykay Brady: 1:33
Oh.
Brooke Suchomel: 1:34
That would come. That would happen like a decade or so later, but...
Kaykay Brady: 1:38
But not because of Iran-Contra.
Brooke Suchomel: 1:39
Not because of the Iran-Contra affair. Yeah. And everybody learned their lesson and we're great!
Kaykay Brady: 1:44
Right, you said that last time. Thank God, you know?
Brooke Suchomel: 1:47
Yeah, it keeps coming back. But that's the thing, that's how big of a story this was in 1987.
Kaykay Brady: 1:53
Yeah.
Brooke Suchomel: 1:54
And I think a lot of people, like, don't know just exactly how fucked up this was.
Kaykay Brady: 1:58
Yeah.
Brooke Suchomel: 1:58
But it was really fucked up, and we forgot all about it. And in case you didn't know, Reagan sucked.
Kaykay Brady: 2:05
Little hot tip for our young listeners - Reagan sucked!
Brooke Suchomel: 2:09
Kaykay Brady: 2:10
That's got to be a sound clip. We got to make that.
Brooke Suchomel: 2:14
So while that was going on, while the men were just sucking, women were killing it in the charts, on the music charts. July 1987, the two number one songs of that month were Whitney Houston’s "I Wanna Dance with Somebody."
Kaykay Brady: 2:29
Yeah!
Brooke Suchomel: 2:31
And then that was knocked off by Heart’s "Alone."
Kaykay Brady: 2:35
Ah, wow.
Brooke Suchomel: 2:35
So just such good music in '87. And this month in particular, just chock full of women crushing it.
Kaykay Brady: 2:45
I see lots of these divorced moms blasting "Alone" in their Volvo station wagons.
Brooke Suchomel: 2:53
And "I Wanna Dance with Somebody!" Right?
Kaykay Brady: 2:55
Yeah, both very appropriate.
Brooke Suchomel: 2:57
Yeah, just for like, different...
Kaykay Brady: 2:58
"Til now, always got by on my own. I never really cared until I met you." You can cut that, but...
Brooke Suchomel: 3:07
I'm not even going to try to chime in with that on this. Like, I have not had enough alcohol. We are not at a karaoke bar. I would... I don't want to do that to our listeners, but I appreciate your dedication.
Kaykay Brady: 3:20
No problem.
Brooke Suchomel: 3:21
Yeah, I think it's like, okay, what kind of a day did Mom have at work? Which, you know, depending on whether she had a good day or whether her boss was a dick or not, is like whether or not she's blasting "I Wanna Dance with Somebody" or "Alone."
Kaykay Brady: 3:33
Or "Alone."
Brooke Suchomel: 3:33
Yeah, on the way home. But you also had Gloria Estefan, this was "Rhythm Is Gonna Get You."
Kaykay Brady: 3:38
Oh yeah.
Brooke Suchomel: 3:39
You had "Head to Toe" by Lisa Lisa and the Cult Jam, like, just such good songs. So little plug, we do a soundtrack for every episode with 10 songs that were popular that month that we're talking about. So all of those songs are going to be on our soundtrack, so if you haven't checked it out already, Spotify, we've got soundtracks. We do the actual videos from MTV at the time on our YouTube channel. Trying to serve up some of that goodness.
Kaykay Brady: 4:06
That's gonna be a really good compilation with all those songs.
Brooke Suchomel: 4:09
Oh, it's so good. It's so good, and I'm very careful to mix it together. So when you are blasting this as your, I don't know, like, this is my kind of, I'm cleaning the kitchen music.
Kaykay Brady: 4:21
Yeah.
Brooke Suchomel: 4:21
You know? Because I don't drive anywhere anymore. Where the hell am I gonna drive? I have nowhere to go. It's 2020! So if you want to get down to like dancing in your kitchen, while you are trying to get all of the potential COVID germs away, check out our shit. It's good.
Kaykay Brady: 4:38
Well, maybe that's why we're doing a throwback to the 80s. Another time when we couldn't drive and a lot of us were stuck inside alone. I don't know, at least the latchkey kids were
Brooke Suchomel: 4:47
Yeah! Seriously.
Kaykay Brady: 4:48
It's like, I think about COVID and I'm like, psh, I've been training for this my whole life.
Brooke Suchomel: 4:52
Exactly.
Kaykay Brady: 4:53
Stuck inside with one other person with a television and music and not much else? Yeah, that's my childhood.
Brooke Suchomel: 5:00
Yeah, it's like you're 12, and it's the summer. But for a year, and you're middle aged.
Kaykay Brady: 5:06
Yeah!
Brooke Suchomel: 5:10
Yeah. So when you look at it that way, you know, it's- we're reliving our childhood, so...
Kaykay Brady: 5:14
Yeah, that's how I choose to frame it for myself.
Brooke Suchomel: 5:17
Totally. And speaking of reliving your childhood, there were so many classic movies that were released in July 1987. Holy shit.
Kaykay Brady: 5:25
I can't wait.
Brooke Suchomel: 5:26
I have been waiting for this particular movie, which is- the first weekend of July 1987 was the release of Adventures in Babysitting.
Kaykay Brady: 5:33
Ah, yeah!
Brooke Suchomel: 5:35
Which is probably the 80s movie, like, you know, you talk about your HBO movies that you've seen over and over again. I mean, "I've Got the Babysitting Blues" is in my head at least twice a month. At least twice a month!
Kaykay Brady: 5:46
Oh, yeah. I remember that. That's when they go to the jazz club in downtown Chicago. Is that correct?
Brooke Suchomel: 5:52
Right.
Kaykay Brady: 5:52
Were they in Chicago?
Brooke Suchomel: 5:54
Yes. And Elizabeth Shue just gets up on stage and just starts, like, freestyling. And, you know, the musicians behind her know exactly what to play and she knows exactly- like, they're just into it. I love that moment so much. So that movie came out in July '87. It was shortly followed by Robocop, and then closing out the month was The Lost Boys.
Kaykay Brady: 6:21
Wow.
Brooke Suchomel: 6:21
So this is, like, so much of your childhood came out this month.
Kaykay Brady: 6:26
Yeah. Rock 'em sock 'em classics.
Brooke Suchomel: 6:29
For real. And so did the sixth Baby-sitters Club book, Kristy's Big Day.
Kaykay Brady: 6:33
Yeah, woo!
Brooke Suchomel: 6:34
So, time for the back cover copy. And once again, I quote. "Kristy's mom is getting married, and Kristy's a bridesmaid. The only trouble is, fourteen little kids are coming to the wedding, and they all need babysitters. Here comes the Baby-sitters Club! [air horn] Stacey, Claudia, Mary Anne, Dawn, and Kristy think they can handle fourteen kids. But that's before they spend five days changing diapers, stopping fights, solving mix-ups, righting wrongs...and getting sick and tired of baby-sitting. One thing's for sure. This is a crazy way to have a wedding. But it's a great way to have a lot of fun!" End quote. The look on your face leads me right into my question, because far be it from me to question the veracity of the hallowed Baby-sitters Club back cover copy, but I got to ask you, Kaykay, did the events of this book seem like, quote, "a lot of fun" to you?
Kaykay Brady: 7:37
I was just gonna say, that is an incorrect characterization. I was exhausted just reading this book. And you seriously couldn't pay me enough...
Brooke Suchomel: 7:50
Right?
Kaykay Brady: 7:51
To do what they did. And I was a camp counselor and I had thirty 4-year-olds in my group.
Brooke Suchomel: 7:58
Oh, Jesus.
Kaykay Brady: 7:59
Yeah. And Tommy Hilfiger's daughter was in my group.
Brooke Suchomel: 8:03
Oh, the one that was in Rich Girls on MTV?
Kaykay Brady: 8:06
I don't know. I think it was the littler one than that.
Brooke Suchomel: 8:09
Okay. It was Ally Hilfiger. And why do I know this? Because I get stupid shit that does me absolutely no good stuck in my brain. So I will crush it at pub quiz, but...
Kaykay Brady: 8:20
I don't know. It could have been her. I can't remember.
Brooke Suchomel: 8:22
You should watch that. You should see if you can find Rich Girls from MTV on YouTube and see if it was her.
Kaykay Brady: 8:29
Yeah, sounds like a good use of my time. This was also the year, when I was a camp counselor, and all the campers loved me because we had a camp counselor talent show and I enlisted my two other co-counselors and we rapped MC Lyte's, Missy Elliot's "Cold Rock a Party." We rapped it for all the kids.
Brooke Suchomel: 8:48
Wow.
Kaykay Brady: 8:49
Yeah, they were so into it.
Brooke Suchomel: 8:51
That's amazing. That is like the opposite of the one time that I went to camp. I only went to camp once, and it was 4-H camp.
Kaykay Brady: 9:00
Oh, no.
Brooke Suchomel: 9:02
Do you know what 4-H is?
Kaykay Brady: 9:03
Ah, is it some sort of farming situation? We didn't really have that in New York.
Brooke Suchomel: 9:07
Yeah, I mean, it was like all that there was in Iowa. You either did that or else you went to like a church camp.
Kaykay Brady: 9:16
Oy.
Brooke Suchomel: 9:17
Yeah. So I did 4-H camp. And our, like, cabin equivalent for the talent show- I was pushing for "U Can't Touch This." For us to do a performance of "U Can't Touch This" with, like, the Hammer dance.
Kaykay Brady: 9:27
Beautiful.
Brooke Suchomel: 9:31
But I got outvoted and they chose to sing "You're in Love" by Wilson Phillips.
Kaykay Brady: 9:39
Horseshit!
Brooke Suchomel: 9:39
And not even sing, but all just stand there and lip sync it.
Kaykay Brady: 9:45
Nooooooo!
Brooke Suchomel: 9:45
Just, like, a bunch of 10-year-olds.
Kaykay Brady: 9:47
How the fuck did you get overruled?
Brooke Suchomel: 9:50
Right?
Kaykay Brady: 9:51
Oh man. You know, I wish we had met then. We would have taken over camp.
Brooke Suchomel: 9:55
I needed you, Kaykay. I needed you.
Kaykay Brady: 9:56
You needed to be rapping "Cold Rock a Party" with me.
Brooke Suchomel: 9:59
Seriously! Seriously.
Kaykay Brady: 10:00
And listeners, if you haven't heard "Cold Rock a Party," it's a great overlooked 90s hip hop song.
Brooke Suchomel: 10:07
Well, that's gonna definitely be on our Video Footnotes. That will be, for sure, I will find that. But I just refused to partake in such nonsense. Particularly, as like, we were one of the last groups to go and I'm sitting there and I am watching, like, skits happen. Like, the kids are laughing, like, there is none of this stand and lip sync a shitty Adult Contemporary song nonsense. It's not even like, "Hold On," right? Which can give you some opportunity to like...
Kaykay Brady: 10:38
At least people know that.
Brooke Suchomel: 10:42
Right! This was just the shittiest of shit songs.
Kaykay Brady: 10:45
That's a B-side. You're gonna stand up there and do a Wilson Phillips B-side lip sync.
Brooke Suchomel: 10:51
Just stand there. And that's actually a long song.
Kaykay Brady: 10:55
As I'm sure you discovered.
Brooke Suchomel: 10:57
And so I discovered this because I refused. I was like, "I am not doing this." I was like, "I do not endorse this." And so I went to the bathroom before we were going to go and I was like, I'm just gonna hang out in this bathroom stall. And so I just won't come out. I'll be in the bathroom, they'll have to go up and then I will get out of it. They stopped the fricking thing and brought every female counselor in to drag me out of the bathroom stall.
Kaykay Brady: 11:24
Oh, your strategy backfired!
Brooke Suchomel: 11:26
Right. So the whole thing is stopped. Everybody is waiting for- like, what's going on? As everybody comes in to drag me out. And I was just like, "No, no, no, no, I can't," you know, so I'm trying to like pretend like I'm having like a bowel emergency or something like that, trying to get out of this. They were like, "We'll wait." I'm like, I mean, it was a nightmare.
Kaykay Brady: 11:46
You're in there like [fart noises].
Brooke Suchomel: 11:54
Oh, totally. Like [air horn]. Yeah, I was in there like that. And they dragged me out. I was crying at that point. Cuz I'm like, this is so humiliating, everything is backfiring. And so they forced me to stand up there, and I've got, like, tears streaming down my face. I'm 10.
Kaykay Brady: 12:14
You poor thing.
Brooke Suchomel: 12:17
And every girl around me is singing- lip synching "You're In Love." I refused to lip sync. I'm like, "I will stand here." I just had my arms folded across my chest, tears streaming down my face, because I was so fucking embarrassed by this nonsense.
Kaykay Brady: 12:29
That such a horror show.
Brooke Suchomel: 12:31
And I'm watching everybody that's watching me and looking at me and laughing. So I didn't go back to camp!
Kaykay Brady: 12:38
That was it for camp. Brooke never went back to camp.
Brooke Suchomel: 12:41
That was it for me!
Kaykay Brady: 12:41
That was like the time when I went to your hip hop dance class, and they played French rap. And I left immediately and never came back.
Brooke Suchomel: 12:49
It was not only French rap. It was Tony Parker, the NBA player.
Kaykay Brady: 12:55
I've got my standards, I left.
Brooke Suchomel: 12:57
And to be fair, this was a sub. Do you think I would go back a second time?
Kaykay Brady: 13:01
No, I don't.
Brooke Suchomel: 13:01
If it was, like, French rap? But it was so horrible.
Kaykay Brady: 13:04
What if it was hip hop to Wilson Phillips? Would you do that?
Brooke Suchomel: 13:07
Definitely not "You're In Love." I cannot listen to that song. If that song comes on? Hell no. But "Hold On"...
Kaykay Brady: 13:13
Well, I'm really glad that you could process this trauma with us.
Brooke Suchomel: 13:18
Yeah. Thank you. Thanks for being my therapist.
Kaykay Brady: 13:21
That is a great story. You should have just pretended it was a performance piece.
Brooke Suchomel: 13:28
Ah, God. Nightmare.
Kaykay Brady: 13:29
All right. So it was hard to read this book.
Brooke Suchomel: 13:33
It really was.
Kaykay Brady: 13:34
It wasn't fun to read it either. Like, I have to say it was a slog to read this book. It was the first one where I was just like, "Oh, how many chapters?" I mean, it's a tiny little book with 14 chapters of 16-point font that takes you at best, you know, a couple hours to get through. And I was like, argh...
Brooke Suchomel: 13:53
Yeah, it reminded me of why I don't have children.
Kaykay Brady: 13:58
Yes.
Brooke Suchomel: 14:03
I am convinced that it's all of my time spent babysitting, and my position as the oldest grandchild by a pretty wide margin, and always sort of being the one, like, responsible for caring for a passel of children. That is fantastic birth control.
Kaykay Brady: 14:22
That is so funny, because I was the opposite. There was one younger cousin, but I was the second youngest in an entire huge, extended Irish family. And I too, decided not to have children. And I thought it was because I never had to do that stuff. And so it just seemed so ridiculously painful to me to think about doing that, you know, where I was like, "I just get to go play with my bike and everybody takes care of me! That's better!"
Brooke Suchomel: 14:46
Yeah, there's two sides of the pendulum swing. It's like, when you are responsible for way too many kids at way too young of an age, or when you're not responsible for kids at all. Like, both of those ends can lead to child free by choice.
Kaykay Brady: 15:04
They can lead to a very fulfilling adult life.
Brooke Suchomel: 15:07
Right!
Kaykay Brady: 15:10
That's my take on it, but I'm a weird homo.
Brooke Suchomel: 15:12
I like weird homos! Weird homos are the best.
Kaykay Brady: 15:16
Yeah, we got some good qualities.
Brooke Suchomel: 15:18
For real. But this particular book was painful. It reminded me a lot of, just, kind of everything negative about the 80s.
Kaykay Brady: 15:31
Oh, say more.
Brooke Suchomel: 15:32
In so many ways. Well, okay, so I'll just start off with the A plot.
Kaykay Brady: 15:37
Yeah, go for it.
Brooke Suchomel: 15:38
When we get into, "What are they fighting?" It's like, that defines the problem that I have with the 80s. So the A plot was they are responsible for caring for fourteen fucking kids for like, nothing. For no pay. I mean, this was just a catalog of exploitation, of egregious child labor violations. I mean, $3 an hour is some bullshit.
Kaykay Brady: 16:05
Total bullshit.
Brooke Suchomel: 16:07
Bullshit! And can I remind everybody, Watson's a millionaire. Like, this is said over and over again.
Kaykay Brady: 16:13
Yeah, that was my whole question about this whole plot, you know, they're loaded. Why are they doing a DIY wedding? You know, he's a wealthy adult. He's got resources. Why are they foisting a pack of fourteen kids on 12-year-olds who are also in the wedding? That, to me, didn't make a whole lot of sense.
Brooke Suchomel: 16:31
Well, I mean, call back to the whole, "Hey, everybody, Reagan sucks." Why did Reagan suck? For many reasons, but also, Reaganomics sucks! He's a millionaire because he obviously doesn't pay.
Kaykay Brady: 16:43
Because he's cheap!
Brooke Suchomel: 16:44
Because he's a cheap ass, you know? Like, squeeze others. I mean, I looked it up, and the 1987 minimum wage in the state of Connecticut was $3.37 an hour.
Kaykay Brady: 16:58
Wow. I love that you looked that up. Hard data coming at you in this podcast, we're not pulling this shit out of our asses.
Brooke Suchomel: 17:06
Nope. We do our research.
Kaykay Brady: 17:07
We research. We work. "You betta werk."
Brooke Suchomel: 17:09
Right. This why I can state to our listeners clearly and with confidence that Reagan sucks, because I know what I'm talking about, but that's a whole other podcast. But yeah, $3.37 an hour. So even when they get their $10 bonus, they're making $3.25 an hour, which is still below minimum wage. And just goes to show you how women's labor is perpetually undervalued.
Kaykay Brady: 17:35
Undervalued.
Brooke Suchomel: 17:36
I mean, this is why we still have the wage gap that we have today, because we're going through hundreds of years of being screwed over by the patriarchy.
Kaykay Brady: 17:46
Amen, girl.
Brooke Suchomel: 17:46
And it is just- that's what this book is. It's like, look at these young women- not even women yet, like, these are children, you know, having all of this responsibility that goes far beyond their years thrust upon them, because the adults just can't be fucking bothered.
Kaykay Brady: 18:07
Yet again, this is the ultimate "adults failing to adult" story.
Brooke Suchomel: 18:12
Yes.
Kaykay Brady: 18:13
You know, where they basically just can't figure it out. Rather than wait to get married, they're like, "All right, let's do it in two weeks, because we have to move." Like, why do you have to get married before you move in together?
Brooke Suchomel: 18:24
That's the whole thing, it's like, "What the fuck?"
Kaykay Brady: 18:25
Why? It's your second marriage. There's no bridal bed here. Like, we're not laboring under any delusions.
Brooke Suchomel: 18:31
Right! And even if it's this whole, like, "Oh, we simply cannot," you know.
Kaykay Brady: 18:36
Yeah, Connecticut.
Brooke Suchomel: 18:36
"We wouldn't want anyone to think we're sleeping together before we get married," you know, woman with four kids and man with two kids. You supposedly have like, what, a nine bedroom house? Like, if you want to put on this whole facade of propriety, there are other ways to go about that. Or, if you really must do this, which- why do you have to do this? Like, Kristy's mom, who she refers to- I love how she refers to her, like, in the first couple of pages as "the divorced Elizabeth Thomas."
Kaykay Brady: 19:06
I saw that!
Brooke Suchomel: 19:06
Did you notice that? "My mother, the divorced Elizabeth Thomas," like, so formal.
Kaykay Brady: 19:14
It sounds like a great Lifetime movie. "The Divorced Elizabeth Thomas." I mean, what would happen in that Lifetime movie?
Brooke Suchomel: 19:22
Apparently, you would exploit your children in that Lifetime movie.
Kaykay Brady: 19:27
Okay, but I will say, it did lead me to really having a burning desire to know from you, what would you have done with $200 at 12 years old?
Brooke Suchomel: 19:37
Oh, man.
Kaykay Brady: 19:38
Because that's what they got. Each of them wound up getting paid about $200 for multiple days of torture.
Brooke Suchomel: 19:44
If only, they each ended up with $130.
Kaykay Brady: 19:47
Oh.
Brooke Suchomel: 19:48
Because again, Watson, a millionaire- why is he a millionaire? 'Cause he's a cheap motherfucker. So, I still remember this. I had been saving my babysitting money for quite some time. And at one point, I negotiated with my mom that I could take out half of what I had in my savings. And I think I was probably about the age that these girls were, 12. And I still remember the exact dollar amount, because I thought to myself, "This is the most money that I can imagine." I remember laying there in bed, the night before I was going to the mall to spend it, and I was just like, "Holy shit." How... I never dreamed I could be...
Kaykay Brady: 20:33
I was hoping you were gonna say, you're gonna be laying in the money. Like a rap star.
Brooke Suchomel: 20:36
Yeah, I was rolling around in $72.
Kaykay Brady: 20:40
In singles?
Brooke Suchomel: 20:40
It was $72. I remember it exactly.
Kaykay Brady: 20:46
$72, that's so great! You were rich!
Brooke Suchomel: 20:50
I was so rich. I don't remember everything that I got, but I remember three things that I got. I remember them vividly. So I went to Westdale Mall, and one of the things I got was this shirt that I still think about to this day. It was the best shirt, like, Claudia would have approved of this shirt. It was an electric blue- it looked like a blazer but it wasn't a blazer. It was, like, a shirt that you just pulled over your head, but it had like the fake buttons and everything on it.
Kaykay Brady: 21:21
Damn. It's so Clair Huxtable. That's who I'm seeing.
Brooke Suchomel: 21:23
It was electric blue, it came to the waist, and it had like a black lapel and black buttons.
Kaykay Brady: 21:31
Yeah!
Brooke Suchomel: 21:32
And I looked like I was- I mean, I could have been a dancer for like C&C Music Factory or something like that. Like, it was spectacular.
Kaykay Brady: 21:41
And what was that, like $12, maybe?
Brooke Suchomel: 21:43
I don't remember. But I got that at Vanity, the store Vanity. And then I got, it must've been, well maybe it was even two pounds of Red Hots in, like, a white paper bag from the Hallmark store. I remember that.
Kaykay Brady: 22:00
You bought two pounds of Red Hots from the Hallmark store?
Brooke Suchomel: 22:05
Yes.
Kaykay Brady: 22:05
You didn't have candy stores in Iowa?
Brooke Suchomel: 22:07
The Hallmark store would have specials, so you could go and sometimes the Red Hots would be like $1 a pound.
Kaykay Brady: 22:12
Yeah, probably because they were like 25 years old.
Brooke Suchomel: 22:15
That's fine! Stale Red Hots are even better, are you kidding? When they get all stale, and you can kind of peel the coating off with your teeth.
Kaykay Brady: 22:21
Oh, no!
Brooke Suchomel: 22:22
Hell yeah. Now I really want some Red Hots. And then I got a tape of MTV Party To Go.
Kaykay Brady: 22:29
Oh shit, what was on that?
Brooke Suchomel: 22:32
"The Humpty Dance" was on it.
Kaykay Brady: 22:33
Oh, classic. Beautiful.
Brooke Suchomel: 22:34
So that's all you need to know. But it also had like, leading into "The Humpty Dance" was a remix of Jane Child's "Don't Wanna Fall in Love." It was money well spent. So I don't know what else I did with my $72. It certainly didn't encompass all of my riches that I had that day, but those are the three things I remember buying. What about you? What would you have done with $72 or $130, or whatever sort of wealth you might have in your pocket at the age of 12?
Kaykay Brady: 23:02
I mean, that's an easy one. Transformers. They had this incredible line of super realistic Transformers. They were like a foot tall. I mean, they were big. And they transformed into three different things, and they were like $200.
Brooke Suchomel: 23:19
Really?
Kaykay Brady: 23:20
And I remember that I got one for my- wait, how old are you when you do First Holy Communion? You're really young, right, like six?
Brooke Suchomel: 23:27
You're like seven or eight.
Kaykay Brady: 23:29
Yeah, no. So it must have been my confirmation. I got like a top of the line $200 Transformer.
Brooke Suchomel: 23:35
That's like 15, and I love thinking of you at 15 really wanting a $200 Transformer.
Kaykay Brady: 23:41
Yeah, I mean, I was gay as they come.
Brooke Suchomel: 23:43
I mean, there's so many Catholic milestones.
Kaykay Brady: 23:46
Yeah, you're like, it was some other Catholic milestone.
Brooke Suchomel: 23:49
Maybe it's when you had your First Confession? Who knows.
Kaykay Brady: 23:53
That old Confession gift.
Brooke Suchomel: 23:54
First Confession, here's a Transformer.
Kaykay Brady: 23:55
Oh, shit. Well, I gotta say the best Easter gift I ever got was a longboard skateboard. That was...
Brooke Suchomel: 24:01
Nice.
Kaykay Brady: 24:01
I was like, "There is a Lord! I wasn't sure that I was a believer, but thank you, Mom, for this skateboard." All right, so obviously... all right, I would have done a Transformer, and, um...
Brooke Suchomel: 24:11
What was your Transformer? What was your fancy Transformer? What did it change into?
Kaykay Brady: 24:14
Well, it was white. It was fantastic. It was bright white. And it was a plane, it was a Lamborghini, and of course, it's a robot.
Brooke Suchomel: 24:24
Amazing.
Kaykay Brady: 24:25
Yeah, it was... I was obsessed with that thing.
Brooke Suchomel: 24:28
So by land or by air.
Kaykay Brady: 24:29
That's right. That's how I roll! So I was remembering, I had a lawn mowing business. And I was such an early capitalist, I had so much money.
Brooke Suchomel: 24:42
How did I not know this?
Kaykay Brady: 24:43
Oh yeah, I had so much money. I was mowing everyone's lawn. I loved it. I think I had like $500 saved in like a year. I saved it for a really, really long time. And then I went out and I bought the most kick ass BMX bike with the trick pegs.
Brooke Suchomel: 24:59
How is this not a book series?
Kaykay Brady: 25:02
"Kaykay's Life."
Brooke Suchomel: 25:03
Or just, like, instead of a Baby-sitters Club, it's like a bunch of lesbians with a lawn care business.
Kaykay Brady: 25:12
Oh shit! And we have friends that we would easily write into this series.
Brooke Suchomel: 25:17
Oh my god. So good. It's like lawn care and dog care.
Kaykay Brady: 25:23
Yeah. You bring two lesbians, one watches the dogs and one mows the lawn.
Brooke Suchomel: 25:29
So I kind of want that to be a book series, and I kind of also want that to be a business. Like, this is gonna be a continuous conversation.
Kaykay Brady: 25:37
Well, you know, I'm sure- hopefully, there are some young listeners out there.
Brooke Suchomel: 25:40
Get on that!
Kaykay Brady: 25:40
And if you're looking for, if you're looking for a lucrative side hustle, and you're a lesbian, or queer, you know the kids, they're less into to the stringent labels, you know.
Brooke Suchomel: 25:52
You don't have to label!
Kaykay Brady: 25:52
You know, non binary lawn business.
Brooke Suchomel: 25:54
Right, or even if you're, like, cis-hetero boring ass vanilla like me? As long as you're cool.
Kaykay Brady: 26:02
Yeah!
Brooke Suchomel: 26:02
You can be a part of it.
Kaykay Brady: 26:04
Exactly. You can mow some lawns!
Brooke Suchomel: 26:06
Well...
Kaykay Brady: 26:07
Brooke's like, "Actually..."
Brooke Suchomel: 26:07
I'll take care of the dogs.
Kaykay Brady: 26:10
Brooke's like, "No, actually, that doesn't sound fun. It sounds better for someone else to do that and I watch the dogs." Great.
Brooke Suchomel: 26:17
But even in- like, think about it. Even in the winter, you could be, like, snow removal.
Kaykay Brady: 26:22
Yeah, I did that too.
Brooke Suchomel: 26:23
And we'll like, hang up holiday lights for you and shit.
Kaykay Brady: 26:26
I did that too. And you know, I'm a squat little Irish woman that was basically meant to be digging potatoes. So I had endless amounts of energy to do your manual labor.
Brooke Suchomel: 26:38
Thank God.
Kaykay Brady: 26:38
Because my body is like, "Why are we not on an island in the Atlantic digging potatoes all day?"
Brooke Suchomel: 26:44
Man. The potential is so rich. I'm loving this so much.
Kaykay Brady: 26:50
What were we talking about? We got off on a tangent.
Brooke Suchomel: 26:52
We were talking about the A plot of exploitation and egregious child labor violations. So we're on theme of the child labor violations. But then the B plot I had was, Kristy and her siblings grapple with their impending move to Watson's and the change in both their family dynamics and their concept of home.
Kaykay Brady: 27:12
Yep.
Brooke Suchomel: 27:13
Which really, I mean, it just goes to show you that should have been the A plot.
Kaykay Brady: 27:19
Yeah.
Brooke Suchomel: 27:19
In a just world, that would have been the A plot, 'cause there's a lot to unpack there, like as a 12-year-old, this sort of emotional turmoil that you would be going through. I mean, we hear that Kristy, she's lived in this home her entire life, like her bedroom has been her bedroom, set up the way that it's been.
Kaykay Brady: 27:39
Yeah. And all her friends live on the same street. And she has this little business that she runs with her friends, and that's about to get fucked up.
Brooke Suchomel: 27:47
Right. You know, and you see there's little glimpses of that, like when she and her three brothers are talking about, "Oh, David Michael got his first plaque to hang up on the awards wall." And this is two weeks before they're going to be moving. And you know, so he has this moment, but it doesn't even get to last. Like, he knows this is just a temporary thing, like you might as well just tack it up on the fridge with a magnet, right? There's nothing permanent about this.
Kaykay Brady: 28:17
Yet again, David Michael gets the shaft.
Brooke Suchomel: 28:20
Poor David Michael.
Kaykay Brady: 28:21
Poor David Michael. He's on a therapist couch right now.
Brooke Suchomel: 28:23
I hope so.
Kaykay Brady: 28:24
Yeah, exactly.
Brooke Suchomel: 28:26
And you see, they have these sort of wistful exchanges, but it's only for like a page. Whereas you've got 153 pages, and you've got like one page on this traumatic and really something that's going to affect these kids, not just greatly in the present, but also have an impact on the rest of their lives. There's really not a focus on that, because everyone is so distracted. Again, they've been engaged for nine months.
Kaykay Brady: 29:01
I know.
Brooke Suchomel: 29:02
So they decide in June, they're going to get married in September, and then like the next day or something, it's, "Oh, no, we're gonna get married in two weeks." Like, Kristy's mom, who up until this point has kind of been, like, the best parent that we see. She's a working single mom, she's got a lot on her plate, but she tries. And in this particular book, you see her not trying.
Kaykay Brady: 29:26
Yeah, I totally agree.
Brooke Suchomel: 29:27
You see her being so fucking selfish.
Kaykay Brady: 29:28
She's in the doghouse for me after this book. And you know, what you're saying is basically if she had contemplated this beforehand, or put any of the child's needs or thoughts or feelings on the table, this should have been handled.
Brooke Suchomel: 29:48
Absolutely.
Kaykay Brady: 29:49
With at least some of their experience being taken into consideration.
Brooke Suchomel: 29:54
Yeah.
Kaykay Brady: 29:54
You know, maybe not everything has to go according to what's most comfortable for the kids. And that's super 80s.
Brooke Suchomel: 30:01
Oh, yeah.
Kaykay Brady: 30:02
You know, just like, "Oh, we're moving. We're moving again."
Brooke Suchomel: 30:05
Yeah, the kids will have to deal.
Kaykay Brady: 30:06
Yeah.
Brooke Suchomel: 30:07
Just deal.
Kaykay Brady: 30:08
Yeah, there was no sense of the whole world, you know, gets sort of built around you. It was like the world's constantly changing, and you're going to adapt or not.
Brooke Suchomel: 30:18
Right. And not even a conversation with the kids about what this means for them.
Kaykay Brady: 30:24
And I'll say, they're lucky that the kids' trauma response here is hypervigilance.
Brooke Suchomel: 30:30
Yes.
Kaykay Brady: 30:30
Right? Because that's keeping this shit show on the road is all of their hypervigilance, because it easily could have been depression or drug use.
Brooke Suchomel: 30:40
100%.
Kaykay Brady: 30:40
That's the road I went.
Brooke Suchomel: 30:42
Right. So I mean, I think we've touched on, I mean, I'll just go right out and say it, you know, when I've got- what are they fighting? I had, they are fighting an overwhelming and completely inappropriate responsibility being foisted upon them by the self-centeredness of the adults in their lives.
Kaykay Brady: 30:57
Mm hmm.
Brooke Suchomel: 30:58
And the tool that they're using to fight that, you just described it as hypervigilance, which I think is perfect. Like a one-word summation of what I had, which is, organization and a dogged persistence and patience beyond their years.
Kaykay Brady: 31:12
Yep.
Brooke Suchomel: 31:13
Everything that these kids are going through, and none of the parents step in. There's so many parents, parents coming from other parts of the country coming in, none of them...
Kaykay Brady: 31:25
With a plan.
Brooke Suchomel: 31:27
None of them step in to say, "Hey, maybe we're putting too much on these kids." You know? I mean, you've got Mary Anne, there's a scene where Mary Anne is trying to figure out how to take the two babies for a walk in a stroller, and she just shoves one baby on top of the other. Just like stacks two babies. And I love how one of the baby's names is Tony.
Kaykay Brady: 31:51
I know. And also like the other names were like Patrick, and we had a real Irish-Italian blending here, which was very funny to me.
Brooke Suchomel: 32:00
I think it's probably pretty clear that Ann M. Martin named these kids after people, like these are all names of people that Ann M. Martin knows because they don't make sense. The names, together.
Kaykay Brady: 32:12
Yeah, she's like, "Oh, Patrick, Tony, Jose."
Brooke Suchomel: 32:16
A baby named Tony. I don't know why that makes me laugh so hard, just thinking about a baby named Tony.
Kaykay Brady: 32:26
Well this is how I know you're not from the East Coast because there are so many babies named Tony on the East Coast.
Brooke Suchomel: 32:32
You call the baby "Tony"?
Kaykay Brady: 32:34
You call the baby "Little Tony." And then the dad is "Big Tony." That's what you do.
Brooke Suchomel: 32:40
I mean, "Little Tony" would at least be an acknowledgement of how hilar-
Kaykay Brady: 32:43
And then maybe you can call him "A.T." Or you also might call him "Anthony Jr." or "A.J."
Brooke Suchomel: 32:49
See, that wouldn't make me laugh. "Anthony Jr." "Anthony." "A.J." That is appropriate. But "Tony"?
Kaykay Brady: 32:57
I know.
Brooke Suchomel: 32:58
Tony smokes a cigar.
Kaykay Brady: 33:00
I was gonna say, Tony...
Brooke Suchomel: 33:00
I don't care how old Tony is.
Kaykay Brady: 33:02
For me, you know, that little baby is gonna sell you coke.
Brooke Suchomel: 33:06
Yes! That's what's in Tony's diaper.
Kaykay Brady: 33:11
He's gonna sell you coke and try to get you to go to the Limelight.
Brooke Suchomel: 33:14
Oh, God. Yeah, so Tony is the baby of four kids whose names are Catherine, Patrick, Maura -- like a three year old named "Maura?"
Kaykay Brady: 33:24
I know, it's great.
Brooke Suchomel: 33:26
And Tony. Tony is eight months old. And that delighted- like, imagining an eight-month-old baby named Tony is what got me through this book. Because every time it came up, I was just like, "Tony's the baby." Tony. Tony's the youngest one. Why is that so funny? It's because he smokes a cigar. There's never been a Tony, named "Tony," Anthony's one thing, but Tony...
Kaykay Brady: 33:50
A Tony baby?
Brooke Suchomel: 33:51
Smokes a cigar.
Kaykay Brady: 33:52
Well, I have so many Tonys in my life, because I'm from the East Coast, and only one smokes a cigar.
Brooke Suchomel: 34:03
But they could. They all...
Kaykay Brady: 34:06
Well they have, certainly, I've seen them smoking cigars.
Brooke Suchomel: 34:09
Right.
Kaykay Brady: 34:09
Okay, that's fair. I've seen them all smoking cigars.
Brooke Suchomel: 34:13
My understanding is that you have to first smoke a cigar to be initiated into using the name "Tony." Until you do that, you're Anthony or A.J.
Kaykay Brady: 34:25
Yeah.
Brooke Suchomel: 34:25
Or even Tony Jr.
Kaykay Brady: 34:27
It's a valid theory.
Brooke Suchomel: 34:27
But just Tony? You have to smoke a cigar first. So, I'm just picturing- like, remember Baby Herman from Who Framed Roger Rabbit? That's who I pictured.
Kaykay Brady: 34:41
Oh, yeah.
Brooke Suchomel: 34:42
As Tony the whole time.
Kaykay Brady: 34:43
Ah yeah! That's good.
Brooke Suchomel: 34:45
And so I'm picturing Mary Anne babysitting Baby Herman and it just brought me infinite joy.
Kaykay Brady: 34:51
Stuffing him in a wagon.
Brooke Suchomel: 34:54
Shoving him on top of another baby.
Kaykay Brady: 34:56
Baby Tony's not gonna take that shit.
Brooke Suchomel: 34:59
No.
Kaykay Brady: 34:59
He'll kneecap ya.
Brooke Suchomel: 35:01
Oh my God. Yeah.
Kaykay Brady: 35:03
Oh, I'm so glad you got such delight out of it. I too got delight out of Baby Tony. But I was wondering more, why are they all Irish names, and then the little kid has an Italian name. I'm like, maybe a different dad? I don't know.
Brooke Suchomel: 35:15
Yeah, there were some weird, tense family dynamics.
Kaykay Brady: 35:19
Oh, yeah.
Brooke Suchomel: 35:19
That were hinted at in this too. So there was so much potential.
Kaykay Brady: 35:24
Also, I would anticipate that Kristy would have had complicated reactions to not only the wedding, but having to wear a dress, having to wear heels. You know, it's just sort of like her character gets lost or is changing really fast in the books in a way that just seems strange.
Brooke Suchomel: 35:48
Yeah. I mean, it says on page 9, when her mom says, "I would like you to be my bridesmaid." She's like, "Like, in a long fancy dress with flowers in my hair?"
Kaykay Brady: 36:00
Yeah!
Brooke Suchomel: 36:01
And Sam says, "Since when do you like long fancy dresses and flowers?" And she goes, "Since right now."
Kaykay Brady: 36:07
Right.
Brooke Suchomel: 36:07
You also see that, in the next chapter, she goes to the dance again with Alan Gray. Goddamnit.
Kaykay Brady: 36:16
I knew you were gonna be outraged.
Brooke Suchomel: 36:18
Goddamnit.
Kaykay Brady: 36:18
I was looking forward to it, your outrage, actually.
Brooke Suchomel: 36:22
So there's probably some weirdness there too, right? And she, at the rehearsal dinner, Stacey and Claudia help her pick out a dress, you know, she talks about how she's wearing a dress that makes her feel, like, glamorous, but then they describe it. And she's like, "It's a big white sweater with some metallic shit on it." So yeah, and then she gets excited about heels. I mean, it's an opportunity for her to like, try on a couple of different personas and sort of, like, see what she thinks of it.
Kaykay Brady: 36:53
Yeah. It just strikes me that the first few books really sort of followed a very traditional trope, which is the sort of tomboy that is constantly clashing against gender norms and expectations. So, for example, Jo March in Little Women, right? So she really comes out of the gate as a very Jo character. And they even do a Little Women shout out in this book.
Brooke Suchomel: 37:19
I had it tabbed.
Kaykay Brady: 37:20
Sam, yeah. So it's just interesting to me that, you know, it really kind of came out hot and heavy out of the gate with that trope. And now that trope is completely going away within six books.
Brooke Suchomel: 37:30
It'll come back.
Kaykay Brady: 37:31
Interesting. So that is my main question, is this, you know, just completely departing, or does it come back later?
Brooke Suchomel: 37:39
Well, that's the bummer of this book. Because it was very difficult to- like, the A plot. Normally, you have multiple plots.
Kaykay Brady: 37:47
Right.
Brooke Suchomel: 37:47
Right? You have multiple things going on. And in this book, like, they don't even babysit any other kids because they cannot. Like, they've got Jamie Newton, but Jamie Newton comes over. And like, I don't know what Jamie Newton's mom is thinking of, like, sure, bring him into this fucking insanity that they're doing for a week, but whatever. So this just is all consuming. And there is so much that, like, the potential of plots in this book is so rich, like, there should have been at least a chapter, not a page, but a chapter of Kristy and her siblings talking through shit.
Kaykay Brady: 38:33
Yeah.
Brooke Suchomel: 38:33
There should have been a chapter- like, you get again, about a page of the Baby-sitters Club, sort of, "Oh, Kristy, you're going to be moving sooner than we thought," like of the friends sort of tackling what this means for them. You should have had a chapter of just Kristy sort of thinking about or exploring all of the different ways that this transition is going to impact her. And then to your point, like, "Okay, now I'm going to be a bridesmaid. I've always been a tomboy, what does it mean?," to deal with and you just don't get any. It's like, normally you get into the girls' thoughts, and their emotions at a deeper level in these books.
Kaykay Brady: 39:17
Yeah.
Brooke Suchomel: 39:18
And in this particular book, it's just action.
Kaykay Brady: 39:22
You make such a good point. And I think, you know, it's making me understand, in this moment, what was so not interesting to me about this book. Like, yes, surface level, haha, it was just about, you know, raising children and how difficult that is. But it was so much less interesting because there wasn't that interplay between, what is this person thinking? What is that person thinking? You know, what, what's the interplay between their thoughts, feelings, and actions? It was just completely missing. So, the blow-by-blow was just kind of boring.
Brooke Suchomel: 39:55
Yeah. And you have all of these new characters that you don't give two shits about.
Kaykay Brady: 39:59
Except for Baby Tony.
Brooke Suchomel: 40:01
Baby Tony, though. Baby Tony is the star of the show.
Kaykay Brady: 40:04
Maura? Get outta here, Maura. Nobody gives a shit about you.
Brooke Suchomel: 40:06
Or, like, Emma? Like, the annoying cousin, like, ugh.
Kaykay Brady: 40:09
I barely remember her. Somebody else had a broken leg. I don't know, some kid had a broken leg.
Brooke Suchomel: 40:14
I love how, okay, let's take the kid with the broken leg fishing.
Kaykay Brady: 40:18
I loved that! And they're like, "Oh, we'll put your leg in a bag and you can just wade out to fish." I'm pretty sure that's not on the rehab plan.
Brooke Suchomel: 40:31
Right. And then later, it's like, the next day, she's laid up complaining about how much her leg hurts. Oh, I wonder why?
Kaykay Brady: 40:39
Oh, well, let's talk about the fact that, uh, I don't know if the opioids were for her, the painkillers? There's like a parent that gives Kristy painkillers and is like, "Okay, she gets blah, blah, blah for pain." I was like, man, do not give a 12-year-old painkillers to administer to a five-year-old. It's bad news.
Brooke Suchomel: 41:01
Man. Yeah, so the core plot of the book, to me, was just not interesting. As much, like, there was a lot of frustrating- there was a lot of "what the fuck" moments. Like, Kristy's mom, what the fuck? Okay, we're gonna have a wedding in two and a half weeks. And we've got a bunch of people who have to come from out of town. And we've got a house that is being sold. People are moving in two weeks later, like, let's just do this.
Kaykay Brady: 41:26
Yeah.
Brooke Suchomel: 41:27
You know, what the fuck? And then stuff like with Watson's ex-wife and her husband are just like, "We're going to England for most of next week and leaving you with them." What? Like, what is that? Like, there is a lot of what the fuckery. And so it's kind of picking up on the other little moments that I found to be the best way to get through this book. Right? Just the little random asides, like, again, a baby named Tony. Holy shit.
Kaykay Brady: 41:57
Genius.
Brooke Suchomel: 41:58
I have been sort of playing with, like, what is the deal with Aunt Theo and Uncle Neil? They haven't seen each other in like two years. The kids, who are cousins, don't really know each other. They leave their baby in the car and, like, Kristy goes and gets it. I mean, there's some weird stuff going on there. You've got the appearance of Nanny and the Pink Clinker.
Kaykay Brady: 42:23
The Pink Clinker!
Brooke Suchomel: 42:25
Which is great, like, Nanny seems like a real treat. Although, where has she been? What has she been doing? Like...
Kaykay Brady: 42:32
Where is she in all of this dysfunction? Yeah, because at one time, they say that, you know, the kids are misbehaving. And they say, "Oh, we're gonna call Nanny," and I guess Nanny doesn't take any bullshit.
Brooke Suchomel: 42:43
Right.
Kaykay Brady: 42:43
So where has Nanny been as all of these families are floundering in life?
Brooke Suchomel: 42:48
She's like, yeah, shuttling the kids to go watch Mary Poppins and sewing a dress. Like, take the kids! Like, if you have to throw this wedding together, if you must do this, Kristy's mom, in like, two weeks? Go buy a fucking dress from a store.
Kaykay Brady: 43:05
Exactly! And hire people to do all the things you need to do and take care of your children.
Brooke Suchomel: 43:11
Right.
Kaykay Brady: 43:11
It's not hard.
Brooke Suchomel: 43:12
No. Instead, what we're gonna do is, you know, probably emotionally guilt trip these people into coming and helping so like, everybody just drops their lives on the shortest notice to like, dedicate themselves to hanging up chrysanthemums in the yard and shit, and making like side salads for the buffet. And that is the priority. Shove all of your kids off with these 12-year-olds. And then Nanny, please, you know, shuttle the kids around if they have to go watch Mary Poppins and make a couple of dresses while you're at it. Nanny should have shut all this shit down.
Kaykay Brady: 43:54
Exactly. Exactly.
Brooke Suchomel: 43:56
I wanna see Nanny and Morbidda Destiny get together, get the two older, wiser women together to just like, handle it.
Kaykay Brady: 44:04
Oh, romance. I smell a romance brewing!
Brooke Suchomel: 44:07
There you go!
Kaykay Brady: 44:07
This is an offshoot series I would read.
Brooke Suchomel: 44:10
The Morbidda Destiny appearance in this book though? Holy shit. Amazing.
Kaykay Brady: 44:16
It's kind of- I would have liked more.
Brooke Suchomel: 44:19
It was so weird.
Kaykay Brady: 44:20
Because it just- it was like she showed up, right? And...
Brooke Suchomel: 44:23
Showed up at the apex of the ceremony. As it's like, "You may now kiss the bride," Morbidda Destiny stands right behind them to give them a gift. You know? Like, what is that? But I've got the 90s version with the Ann M. Martin sort of letter to the reader. And she says that it's this book- she had so much fun writing about Karen in this book, that she decided to do the Little Sister series.
Kaykay Brady: 44:52
Oh, interesting.
Brooke Suchomel: 44:54
And the first book in the Little Sister series is Karen's Witch. So it's like all about Karen and Morbidda Destiny.
Kaykay Brady: 45:00
Well, I think, you know, nowadays Karen is a QAnon follower.
Brooke Suchomel: 45:04
I have the exact same thing written down.
Kaykay Brady: 45:06
No, shut your mouth.
Brooke Suchomel: 45:07
Yep. Right here, "Karen Brewer is into Q."
Kaykay Brady: 45:12
Oh girl! Oh, we had a psychic moment. I also said, you know, all the real life Karens need a Dawn to sit them down and say, "Karen, you know this is just silly stuff, don't you?" That's what all the grown Karens need.
Brooke Suchomel: 45:26
Right. Although Dawn is kind of like Facebook. So I saw this as being an allegory. Karen is Q. Dawn is like Facebook and Twitter and YouTube and like all of the different organizations trying to figure out what the hell to do with Q. Because she says to them, like, "Hey, Karen, Martians aren't real," and just keeps on saying, "That's not real. That's not real."
Kaykay Brady: 45:55
And it's not helping Karen.
Brooke Suchomel: 45:56
And she says that she thinks about telling her that she can't continue to talk about Martians, but then decides that it would be too mean to do so. So she like opts out of barring this conversation from taking place in her presence. And because she refuses to shut the shit down at the source, ultimately, Karen goes and spreads that out on the playground, and you know, gets kicked out of the playground, but not before all of these terrified children have run off.
Kaykay Brady: 46:26
Yeah.
Brooke Suchomel: 46:26
Right? So there's just like children on the loose because she scared the shit out of them. And I'm like, this is- this is Q.
Kaykay Brady: 46:33
I love your metaphor. I would also say Kristy is AfterEllen.com.
Brooke Suchomel: 46:37
Ah, tell me more about that.
Kaykay Brady: 46:39
Just- gay. Yeah, it's so interesting. You almost think at some point that Karen maybe has some like schizotypal tendencies. You know, she's just really out of touch with reality sometimes.
Brooke Suchomel: 47:00
The first sentence in this book is Karen Brewer saying, "Old Ben Brewer was crazy."
Kaykay Brady: 47:09
Right.
Brooke Suchomel: 47:09
Right? So the first paragraph of this book is Karen's sort of delusional theory about- like, all she talks about are, "There's ghosts and there's witches and there's Martians." And it's like, is this what happens to rich kids? Or is this her way of just distracting herself from the chaos that is around her?
Kaykay Brady: 47:36
My guess is it's the way she's manifesting anxiety.
Brooke Suchomel: 47:40
Yeah.
Kaykay Brady: 47:40
And managing anxiety and things that she can't control in her world.
Brooke Suchomel: 47:46
Right, like it's all a conspiracy.
Kaykay Brady: 47:48
They get externalized into creatures and stories and stuff like that. So again, she and David Michael, it'd be really great if you could plop those kids into therapy. They got some stuff to work through.
Brooke Suchomel: 48:02
If you were Karen's therapist, how do you tackle this? And so by that, I mean, "Hey, Kaykay, how do we stop Q?" But let's start with Karen.
Kaykay Brady: 48:15
Well, for a child, you know, you would really want to start to help the child to reflect on the underlying anxiety.
Brooke Suchomel: 48:24
Mm hmm.
Kaykay Brady: 48:24
Right? Because no one is helping her do that. She doesn't have any safe space where someone's going to sit down and actually, you know, help her label that, help her work it through. And in terms of the delusions, you know, when someone is believing in stories and delusions, you don't want to give those delusions more weight, but you also don't want to fight them either. So you would allow those delusions to live, but you would more try to figure out, what are her feelings about the delusion?
Brooke Suchomel: 48:59
Mm hmm.
Kaykay Brady: 49:00
You know, because it's got to be creating a huge amount of stress for her that she's having these feelings and thoughts. So rather than fight the delusion, which just makes it stronger, you actually talk about the feeling. And the same would be true of an adult QAnon follower. You wouldn't try to argue with them that QAnon doesn't exist or is ridiculous. You know, you would say, "Wow, this sounds really scary for you." Right? And then you'd let them talk about their feelings, which is really what's happening for them, and really, why they need, you know, the function that this delusion plays in their life.
Brooke Suchomel: 49:33
Yeah, I mean, as you're talking about it, I was thinking about all of the different delusions that Karen has, and it's interesting how she seems to have, like, a different delusion for wherever she is in the world.
Kaykay Brady: 49:47
Yeah, that's true.
Brooke Suchomel: 49:48
She has a delusion that there is a ghost in her home, right? So within the home, she has a ghost. Just outside the home, literally, immediately outside the home, there's the witch. Once she steps outside of her immediate home and neighborhood environment, there's Martians. So it's like, wherever she goes, there is something that she fears, and she never shuts up about it. And she tells everyone about it, so it's almost like this kid is looking for validation. And when you realize that her dad is, like, getting married, and so now there's going to be a whole new family moving into her home. And, you know, there is a moment of recognition where Kristy's mom talks about how Karen is used to being the oldest, and now she's going to be one of the youngest. And so that's a huge change. And then you see that her mom just got remarried, and she's the kind to be like, "I'm going to England next week! Leaving the kids with you." Like, this would be a kid that has zero
Kaykay Brady: 50:58
Yeah. stability. And she's what, six? So, no wonder she's just like, a bundle of nerves. Yeah, and I think the consistent way that she's doing it speaks to the anxiety.
Brooke Suchomel: 51:14
Right.
Kaykay Brady: 51:15
The way that she's never shutting up about it, you know?
Brooke Suchomel: 51:18
Yeah.
Kaykay Brady: 51:18
That's telling you, giving you a hint, maybe, about what this is really about.
Brooke Suchomel: 51:23
Yeah. No, I think that's a really good point. And it makes me think about how in this current climate that we're in, where everything that we found to be some sort of stability, like, we're seeing that all, sort of, what we had thought would be stable norms, right, that there would be these sort of constraints upon the world that we're operating in, where we could just rely on systems. You know, some of us.
Kaykay Brady: 51:52
Yeah.
Brooke Suchomel: 51:52
Not everybody was operating under this delusion. But I think people who are coming from a privileged place in American society were like, "Oh, well, we can just rely on the quote unquote, 'systems and structures' that have been put in place to make sure that society stays stable for us," that has really fallen away.
Kaykay Brady: 52:15
Exactly.
Brooke Suchomel: 52:16
In the past several years for people. Now granted, there are plenty of people in this country and in other countries who were never operating under that delusion. Who are sitting there going, like, "We've been telling you this."
Kaykay Brady: 52:30
"Welcome. Nice of you to join us!"
Brooke Suchomel: 52:32
Right, right. But, you know, you have people who are now coming to this realization. So it's like, okay, well, then that means that the onus is on you to sort of figure out what to do about it. And for some people, it's like, they're still looking for a sense of order that makes the world make sense. As opposed to realizing that, like, nature is chaos, and individuals have a responsibility to make sure that we, you know, put barriers up in place that allow society to continue to operate. It's, I think, perhaps comforting for some people, like if they're operating in that anxiety of like, "Holy shit, is this all really on us? That's a huge responsibility," to be like, "No, there is still an order. It's just this is the order. And it's this giant, you know, global conspiracy to blah, blah, blah, blah, blah." And so then it sort of removes that pressure to get outside your comfort zone and do something. Instead it's like, "Oh, no, there is still, there's still a logic to this" that doesn't actually exist. And so I think Karen is making up this logic. It's like, "There is chaos in my life. That chaos is not my parents are being really self-centered assholes and not putting me first." You don't want to realize that, right? You don't want to be like, "Oh my God, my parents are supposed to be there for me. They're supposed to be supporting me. That's not happening." Instead, it is, "There's a ghost in the house. There's a witch outside." You know?
Kaykay Brady: 54:13
Kids will do anything to not realize that.
Brooke Suchomel: 54:15
Yeah! Right, "There's Martians. The threat is Martians, not my mom."
Kaykay Brady: 54:18
Mostly it takes the form of things being your own fault.
Brooke Suchomel: 54:22
Hmm.
Kaykay Brady: 54:23
But for Karen, it's taking the form of something else, which is interesting.
Brooke Suchomel: 54:28
Yeah, Karen and David Michael are an interesting sort of yin and yang.
Kaykay Brady: 54:31
Yeah, aren't they the- they get married in the fake little wedding? Because they're the same height.
Brooke Suchomel: 54:37
That is how you find a mate.
Kaykay Brady: 54:38
That is how you pair off. Is that how the straight people do it, Brooke? I've been meaning to ask you.
Brooke Suchomel: 54:42
Yeah, mm hmm. Yeah, yeah, that's how we do it.
Kaykay Brady: 54:45
"Well, we're the same height!"
Brooke Suchomel: 54:46
We just all- you just get a bunch of straight people in a room and you stand up in order of tallest to shortest, and then you just look across and whoever is directly across from you, that's who you marry.
Kaykay Brady: 54:59
I love it. I feel so, uh...
Brooke Suchomel: 55:01
That's straight courtship.
Kaykay Brady: 55:03
I learn so much. I learn so much in this podcast.
Brooke Suchomel: 55:08
I'm happy to educate on the straights. Straight culture is so misunderstood. Oh, God.
Kaykay Brady: 55:18
I've been having this section for the last couple books, which is favorite East Coast / West Coast.
Brooke Suchomel: 55:24
So this is like the Biggie versus Tupac moment?
Kaykay Brady: 55:27
I guess it's sort of like we have favorite 80s moments. I didn't have a lot of favorite 80s moments because it was all just wedding shit, which didn't seem super 80s to me, although you had some good ones with the sweater dress.
Brooke Suchomel: 55:41
I mean, there were a couple of like nods to the 80s. You know, like the moment where Stacey's on a payphone and her quarter runs out.
Kaykay Brady: 55:50
Oh, right. Yeah.
Brooke Suchomel: 55:50
Like, the time runs out. And you know, I remember needing payphones and I remember I figured out like how to rig like the payphone at my school. It was a quarter, but like, actually, if you put a nickel in, it worked too.
Kaykay Brady: 56:03
Oh, shit. You were like what's his name in WarGames.
Brooke Suchomel: 56:06
We also figured out that if you called- for some reason, you could call, like, 1-900 numbers from it for free from our school? They had one by the gym at our middle school. And like we were supposed to be playing like Nok Hockey or some other like quote unquote "gym activity," like, yeah, that's real physical labor, playing frickin' Nok Hockey.
Kaykay Brady: 56:29
Nok Hockey is a fantastic 80s delight. My sister and I had many black eyes from beating each other with Nok Hockey sticks when one of us scored and the other was unhappy about it.
Brooke Suchomel: 56:42
But we used to, like, prank call the Hooked on Phonics phone number. So we were supposed to be playing Nok Hockey, we would just prank call...
Kaykay Brady: 56:52
Hooked on Phonics?
Brooke Suchomel: 56:57
And like, the Jenny Craig- like, 1-800-94-JENNY. We would just like prank call any of the like 1-800 or 1-900 numbers.
Kaykay Brady: 57:06
Again, folks, this is what life was like before the internet. This is what we had to do with our time.
Brooke Suchomel: 57:13
So for Most 80s Moments, the Polaroid, the fact that Kristy was excited about like, you can get your your heels dyed to match your dress.
Kaykay Brady: 57:21
Oh yeah, that was so 80s.
Brooke Suchomel: 57:25
And that went into the 90s. I absolutely did that.
Kaykay Brady: 57:27
That totally went into the 90s.
Brooke Suchomel: 57:28
I absolutely did that for prom, with my dress that, depending on what way I turned, was either purple or green.
Kaykay Brady: 57:37
Oh! What?
Brooke Suchomel: 57:39
Yeah, it was one of those iridescent where like...
Kaykay Brady: 57:41
Shut. Up. I mean, that was a dress you might have been able to get me into. Because that sounds cool.
Brooke Suchomel: 57:48
Like one shoulder, it was pretty dope.
Kaykay Brady: 57:50
That is so dope. Did you have a hat? You know, the 90s were so into like dress hats.
Brooke Suchomel: 57:56
No, we didn't wear hats. But we did- everybody had like the satin opera...
Kaykay Brady: 58:00
I guess that was more weddings.
Brooke Suchomel: 58:01
Yeah, it was like the satin opera length gloves.
Kaykay Brady: 58:03
Hahaha, yeah!
Brooke Suchomel: 58:05
Yeah.
Kaykay Brady: 58:06
Bring those back!
Brooke Suchomel: 58:07
I did get my shoes dyed, somehow. I don't know how they did it, but they did match the iridescent effect. And I really should have kept those shoes.
Kaykay Brady: 58:17
That's so cool.
Brooke Suchomel: 58:18
Otherwise, it was like, there was just so much of this babysitting bullshit happening in the book.
Kaykay Brady: 58:22
Yeah, it was just all the shit show. That was the central plot and there wasn't a lot of space.
Brooke Suchomel: 58:26
Right? Well, and then there was also the moment when the kids all run off because Q Karen has terrified them all.
Kaykay Brady: 58:33
"Q Karen"! She's just Karen with a Q. That's how we'll spell it.
Brooke Suchomel: 58:37
Q-A-R-E-N.
Kaykay Brady: 58:38
Qaren. She's Qaren.
Brooke Suchomel: 58:39
"Quaren," Karen.
Kaykay Brady: 58:41
"Quaren."
Brooke Suchomel: 58:44
When all of the children have sort of like scattered and Dawn tells the counselor, like, "Oh, I'll help you find the kids." And she's like, "Don't worry about it. There's another counselor that will be here in 10 minutes." That felt 80s, like, we'll just- we'll have missing children. Somebody will come by in 10 minutes to help me find them. It's fine.
Kaykay Brady: 59:05
That's so true.
Brooke Suchomel: 59:07
So they were there but you had to dig for them.
Kaykay Brady: 59:09
Yeah.
Brooke Suchomel: 59:10
But what did you have as your Biggie / Tupac moment?
Kaykay Brady: 59:13
Well, my favorite word was in this book. "Pockabook." Somebody talks about their mom having a pocketbook, and that is a very East Coast phrase. They don't say- nobody says "pocketbook" on the West Coast.
Brooke Suchomel: 59:26
No. Do they still say "pocketbook" on the East Coast?
Kaykay Brady: 59:29
Sure, but you just can't say the "T." Just gotta say, "Go get my pockabook upstairs." That was my mom. There you go.
Brooke Suchomel: 59:36
"Paka."
Kaykay Brady: 59:36
"Paka." "Getcha pockabook. I got some gum in my pockabook. My tissues are in my pockabook. Gimme my pockabook. Getcha hands outta my pockabook!"
Brooke Suchomel: 59:47
We need to have "Kaykay does an impression of her mom" moments in every- like, "Get outta my face!"
Kaykay Brady: 59:55
The classic, "Get outta here! I'll break your face." That was the main term of endearment in my household. Brooke cross stitched that for me, and it's now hanging on my wall. "Get outta here, I'll break your face."
Brooke Suchomel: 1:00:08
It's a beautiful sentiment, and I thought that it needed to be immortalized in, you know, the classic fashion. So yeah, this book was... it was special. It was special.
Kaykay Brady: 1:00:20
Yeah, you know, I think we made some lemonade.
Brooke Suchomel: 1:00:23
We did. We did. And speaking of lemonade, I just have to give a shout out to Stacey. Like, the thing that brought me so much joy, probably the most joy besides Baby Tony, was Stacey's entry in the babysitting journal when she takes the kids to go see Mary Poppins. And the entry, that she writes with her "I"s dotted with hearts, starts with, "This is a confession, you guys. I know you think I'm so sophisticated, since I'm from New York and my hair is permed and everything."
Kaykay Brady: 1:01:00
Oh shit! That's so good.
Brooke Suchomel: 1:01:03
You know? And her confession is that her favorite movie is Mary Poppins and that she's seen it 65 times, but I love how it's "I know you think I'm so sophisticated since I'm from New York and my hair is permed and everything."
Kaykay Brady: 1:01:16
That is the height of sophistication. It's in the dictionary.
Brooke Suchomel: 1:01:18
That is the definition, yeah. "Permed hair, from New York."
Kaykay Brady: 1:01:20
When I moved from New York to the suburbs, everybody was just afraid of me. Nobody thought that I was sophisticated. They just thought that I would kick their ass and they were right. But it's just strange to me. I mean, maybe it's...
Brooke Suchomel: 1:01:31
But your hair wasn't permed, right?
Kaykay Brady: 1:01:35
No, it was not.
Brooke Suchomel: 1:01:35
I think that was your problem.
Kaykay Brady: 1:01:36
I think it might be socioeconomic too. But no, that's not true, because I totally had to move into super, you know, 1% circles in the suburbs. And they were all just afraid of me because I was from New York City. There was none of this, like, "Ooh, you're so, ahh," you know? "You're so fancy, you're so sophisticated." It was just, "Oh, like, this one will knife you."
Brooke Suchomel: 1:02:00
I want to see that side of Stacey. So for our next episode, we are going back to Claudia.
Kaykay Brady: 1:02:07
Ooh!
Brooke Suchomel: 1:02:08
And digging into her relationship with her sister with Claudia and Mean Janine.
Kaykay Brady: 1:02:14
All right!
Brooke Suchomel: 1:02:15
So hopefully we'll get more into the level of sort of family dynamics that we were shafted in this particular book. So until then...
Kaykay Brady: 1:02:26
Just keep sittin'. [theme song] Getcha hands outta my pockabook!
